Author Topic: I have lost faith in society  (Read 3302 times)

I see many people cursing out their parents on Facebook for a simple punishment they received for the stupidest actions, and then I feel bad because I see people who are angry over their parents for real issues such as divorce and such. It makes me sick, there seems to be no respect these days for the long lasting and moral foundation of the family. This is yet another thing I see permissive society doing, is trying to attack the structure of the family with its ideals, I dare you to prove me wrong on this.
You realize that one of the reason that divorce rates are getting higher is because there are hardly ever any arranged marriages. In other words,

They can.

Similarly, laws about mutilating your child now exist, so you can't whip them with a belt till they a blue.

You said 'It makes me sick, there seems to be no respect these days for the long lasting and moral foundation of the family.' which is ironic, because there are not really any long lasting moral foundations. Again, the longest lasting one was arranged marriages. When you said people had no respect, you need to realize something. Most people here live in a democracy. That means everyone should be treated equally. If parents don't want you to do something, for any reason other than your safety, that's pretty stupid. If you ask them why, and they can't give you a reason, that's how you know they are doing that to control you. And most people don't respond well to absolute bullstuff control. Think about it. Ever heard of King George? Yea, he was the King when the American Colonies rebelled. That's because he had oppressive rule over them, and treated them like bullstuff.

Of course, you will just dismiss my words as false, but in my mind, and in yours too it will mean I'm right, until you give a valid reason, I don't even have to agree with.

I'm too out-of-touch with modern society to form an unbiased opinion on it, so it intrigues me to read on how you guys thinks about today's society.

I agree with you about most modern music.

Dodger, I am with you all the way, I am anti mainstream as well, and I think technology is getting out of hand and I wish I could just escape it all. I feel like I am the only kid who doesn't conform to today's bullstuff. I really dislike the youth too. They are very stupid and easily manipulate by what they see on TV and it ends up ruining them eventually somehow. They have no morals anymore. They think it's so cool to do drugs and get pregnant and just not care about the real world anymore, if there is one. I hope 2012 wipes them out and let's a kind like us live. I guess we are one of the few old souls out there.
your not alone here
I also have a grudge aginst society.

your not alone here
I also have a grudge aginst society.

Is it cause you're a loser? Most people that hate society are losers

Here is my big thing. I do agree with you Dodger, though.


People who are uneducated on what communism really is. Back in the cold war era, every American fully understood what communism was and how it worked, and how it doesn't work in modern practice. Today, I hear people (20 year olds, kids at my school, etc.) complaining about how horrible our government system is, and how it is slowly bringing an end to America, how a free market system is poisonous to human minds. They complain about life not being fair and that everyone would be equal if the U.S. were to convert to communism, and that life would be simpler. A kid in my school made a remark when we were talking about it, "Hey, that doesn't sound so bad, I want communism." Take note how this is an underachiever, a kid who would rather sleep on his desk than pay attention to the lectures. They would choose a government controlled market system where your life is laid out for you at birth, over freedom to speak against the government with out being executed, to choose what to do in your life and how to achieve it, to make it big, work hard, and live a happy life. I try to explain to them why they wouldn't want communism, but they don't listen, they don't care. They don't want to work hard to get big rewards. They want fairness.

The numbers of increasing socialists/communist supporters in the government and not are alarming.

I also get so loving pissed at the kids who don't PAY ATTENTION TO CURRENT EVENTS OR SCHOOL. God damnit, don't they know that this stuff is important and will affect their lives FOREVER? Like with what is going on in the middle east, most kids in my school had no idea what the hell I was talking about.

Also, the media, oh my god the modern american media. From the wise words of keonesan (paraphrased lol), "The media would care more about Ke$ha dying than the middle east declaring war on the USA."
« Last Edit: May 15, 2011, 12:27:30 PM by Jorici »

   It seems todays mainstream media has become much more shallow and overly obsessed with the individual. This is not a new trend, I know this, but the rate that we are becoming self-absorbed is much more alarming than I realized. This can be seen by the fact that most Hollywood celebrities would rather convert to religions such as Buddhism and Scientology, where they are not subject to any divine judgement. I do not hate/dislike Buddhists themselves, I am just saying that society has become too individualistic for us modern devotionists. This is the very reason religions such as Christianity, Judaism, and Islam are fading away, the fact that people are unwilling to accept subjection to any divine judgement, and a good portion of people would easily prefer a permissive society where they can do almost anything they want. Permissive society is mostly weak minded in my opinion.
   That the media is shallow and self obsessed is a very qualitative argument based on some kind of moralistic interpretation of the terms self obsessed and shallow. I would not agree that media is shallow, but I would agree that it definitely has an obsession with its constituients. I don't think this has to be a bad thing either. Well I guess we should break this down into separate arguments here, a) mainstream media is obsessed with the individual, b) obsession with the individual is scaring people away from "more moral" religions, c) we need divine judgement to be moral people.

   Media is definitely obsessed with people, but that's because it's made by people. It's been this way since the birth of media, since the first caveman decided to draw a painting of himself butchering a mammoth on the wall. All media, at its core, is produced to entertain people. Everything from a newspaper, to music, to Encyclopedia Britanica, to Joe's Almanac of the Occult and Bizzare, are fundamentally written to entertain. Maybe they've got some other goals in there as well, newspapers and encyclopedias are designed to inform, perhaps music evokes emotion. Realize entertain here is a pretty broad term, I don't expect you to necessarily have fun while reading an encyclopedia, but I would expect you to find it interesting and relevant if it was written well. What's more interesting and relevant than other people?

   I also don't think that it has grown any more or less self absorbed. Since that caveman drawing on the wall, since the myths of the Greeks who made their gods in their own image, since Shakespeare wrote Romeo and Juliet, one of the most celebrated English plays full of emotion, jokes, and innuendo, since Amerigo wrote his fantastic account of his adventures in the New World (from which America gets its name), and the dime novels of the 1800s and the more modern literature of today, it's always been all about people. In fact, I'd argue that television are the dime novels of the modern era.

   I don't think this is a bad thing either. First of all, we have to do it. You need to keep people entertained, that's just the way it's always been. The methods people are entertained have changed, from epic fictions to plays to today's "disaster theater" (possibly even disaster research?) that makes up quite a bit of cable news coverage, letting you take part in the great tragedies of the world and the heroic triumphs of individuals from he comfort of your living room.

   For the second argument, I don't think rampant hedonism is driving people away from religion. I think religions are doing a fantastic job of that all on their own and don't need any help. That's what you get (and frankly deserve) when you preach a message of hate and intolerance. People will also only take so much "Science isn't real, ignore gravity" before they decide you're a moron.

   Finally, we don't need religion to be moral. That's just silly. And if you knew anything about Buddhism, you would have realized the Eightfold Path is moral, and combined with the Four Noble Truths it's easy to see why the religion would appeal to a celebrity in particular.

   Another thing that shows this is how a lot of mainstream music as we know today focuses on self pleasure and immoral aspects of society. Almost any shallow, no dimensioned song with a good beat and lyrics about fame, love, and drugs can become a hit these days. What happened to mainstream music that changed the music industry, that was well engineered, that had real artistic value and dimension put into it? If I dare show that I have a dislike for mainstream music that is played everywhere by everyone and express my own for a bit, I'll just be labeled as a "hipster", which is a very ignorant insult in many ways that I shouldn't even have to explain. I'm not trying to look cool by pretending to be against society, I have a true dislike for it.
   Ahaha, well, you answered your own question here and I don't think I even need to touch this one. You said any music that has a good beat can become popular. How can dimensionless songs about love and drugs become popular? Because they've got a good beat. What happened to music that was well engineered, had artistic value, and dimension (whatever the hell that is)? There's your answer: it was well engineered, it has a good beat.

   Another thing that is horribly bugging me is how a lot of youth today are also becoming more shallow and ignorant because of media and self interest. A good percentage of students these days would rather try to have love with others and focus on social relations than to learn important education from schools in which they can apply it to impact society in a positive way. Instead, some kids will like to think that politics and such are dumb because everyone argues so much and tend to ignore it and will most likely become a part of an uneducated and easily swayed electorate that will impulsively vote for the candidate who makes the most outrageous claims in the electorate's interests. This is the reason in my opinion why a lot of radical socialists are gaining support.
   Kids in schools have always been trying to have love. It used to be considered appropriate for a father to bring their son to a prostitute as a rite of passage. Obviously we don't do that anymore. Failure of one student to study and become educated is the failure of one student as an invidual. Endemic failure of many students is a failure of the school and the education system.

   Continuing with the youth, what has happened to the moral standards of most of them? The trend that the general youth population are becoming more and more ignorant and shallow as the years go by seems to apply. I see many people cursing out their parents on Facebook for a simple punishment they received for the stupidest actions, and then I feel bad because I see people who are angry over their parents for real issues such as divorce and such. It makes me sick, there seems to be no respect these days for the long lasting and moral foundation of the family. This is yet another thing I see permissive society doing, is trying to attack the structure of the family with its ideals, I dare you to prove me wrong on this.
   Other things that permisive socities alllow you to do include universal suffrage, civil rights, and the freedom of religion and speech. Maybe you would like to clairfy what you mean by permisive society.

   Gangs are probably the crowning achievement of the degrading morals within our youth. They usually tend to have no respect for anything outside the gang. The public disturbance caused by gangs and their lack of real world productivity shows just how bad mass media is promoting "Gangsta Rap" such as 50 Cent, NWA, etc.. Nearly everything done within a gang is a waste of the youths' time where they could easily be learning skills to benefit the real world and themselves instead of causing petty public disturbance for attention, women, and drugs.
   Gangs are probably the crowning achievement of a failed public policy. The public disturbance caused by gangs and their lack of real world productivity shows just how bad local governments have neglected education and law enforcement. Just another side of the coin.

   Also NWA is awesome, don't be hatin. Here's something you should look into, why did NWA write their songs? If you've ever listened to it it's as much poltical as anything. Realize where songs like forget tha Police came from, there is a genuine animosity between the two groups. Why is that? What is it founded in? I don't think you'll find that NWA wrote it because they hated the cops busting up drug deals.

   Simple laws such as no stealing have also been challenged be less debated but still immoral things such as pirating. The preservation of human life has also been challenged by abortion, which I do not support unless under extreme circumstances. The natural function of nature has also been challenged by practices such as cloning which is not helping an almost overpopulated earth in any practical way. These debatable subjects are only increasing tensions within traditional and liberal forces within society, and usually don't actually impact society in a positive way for most individuals.
   I think that it is odd that you would be against abortion and also believe the world is overpopulated and we should do something about. Recent projections suggest that the world population is going to peak at 9.3 billion around 2080-2100. There is plenty of open land for people to settle still. The reason food is so cheap in the US is because we basically overproduce it - there is a huge surplus of food in the US but it doesn't necessarily make economic sense to ship it anywhere else. A good portion of the food produced in the world is thrown out as waste because it's spoiled or nobody bought it. There's also ways to deal with food shortages, eating less meat is probably the simplest and would go along way. We already eat too much meat, and you could make thousands of loaves of bread with the grain we feed to one animal. More effective transportation methods could help too. Overpopulation would be the least of my concerns.

^ holy stuff. I'm not read- ohwait Wedge wrote it. okay c: i'll go.

Here is my big thing. I do agree with you Dodger, though.


People who are uneducated on what communism really is. Back in the cold war era, every American fully understood what communism was and how it worked, and how it doesn't work in modern practice. Today, I hear people (20 year olds, kids at my school, etc.) complaining about how horrible our government system is, and how it is slowly bringing an end to America, how a free market system is poisonous to human minds. They complain about life not being fair and that everyone would be equal if the U.S. were to convert to communism, and that life would be simpler. A kid in my school made a remark when we were talking about it, "Hey, that doesn't sound so bad, I want communism." Take note how this is an underachiever, a kid who would rather sleep on his desk than pay attention to the lectures. They would choose a government controlled market system where your life is laid out for you at birth, over freedom to speak against the government with out being executed, to choose what to do in your life and how to achieve it, to make it big, work hard, and live a happy life. I try to explain to them why they wouldn't want communism, but they don't listen, they don't care. They don't want to work hard to get big rewards. They want fairness.

The numbers of increasing socialists/communist supporters in the government and not are alarming.

I also get so loving pissed at the kids who don't PAY ATTENTION TO CURRENT EVENTS OR SCHOOL. God damnit, don't they know that this stuff is important and will affect their lives FOREVER? Like with what is going on in the middle east, most kids in my school had no idea what the hell I was talking about.

Also, the media, oh my god the modern american media. From the wise words of keonesan (paraphrased lol), "The media would care more about Ke$ha dying than the middle east declaring war on the USA."

I have 2 quick questions for you. First, why do you hate socialism so much? Also saying people understood communism better in the cold war was one of the dumbest things I have ever heard. They learned all their facts about communism from American propaganda Second, you think the fact that kids don't give a stuff is something new that happened out of nowhere.

From what ive been hearing, All the religons in the world are just causing war
example:
Muslims: YEAH LETS BLOW THE stuff OUT OF STUFF YEH WITH OUR FALSE GOD WHOOPIE
Christains: (no examples here)
boom.
war.

From what ive been hearing, just the most biased religions in the world are starting wars...
example:
Muslims: LET'S ACTUALLY BE ALLOWED TO KEEP OUR RELIGION ASDF DAMN EUROPEANS
Christains: The Crusades, The Spanish Inquisition, The Murder of the Aztecs, The Holocaust. Do I go on?
boom.
war.
« Last Edit: May 15, 2011, 01:24:59 PM by TheKhoz »

why do you hate socialism so much?

I hate it because I live in America. A country built around freedoms and rights, where people have (or had) a voice. While in socialism, the government is the only voice. The living conditions are generally bad, (except for the government officials, what a surprise), it is pretty much the opposite of what made this country successful and a superpower over the last 250 years (though it is declining, from spending, spending, and more spending by the current government). Yes, you may say communist Russia was competing for the superpower spot with the U.S. in the cold war, but that was right after WWII, and what were the powers of before the war were reduced to ash. (Germany, France, etc.) Communism has always been the enemy of the U.S.

About the Cold-War generation of Americans knowing more about Communism, I never said that they didn't have a biased opinion on it, I simply meant that they understood what it was - the opposite of what we all know and live. Opposites cannot exist on this planet for very long. How could you say, "If I moved from America or other democratic/republican country to a communist/socialist country, with a government controlled economy, I would be happy."

You won't.

With the kids not giving a stuff, it seems that the percentages are growing with kids who do drugs, have love, and generally do not care about their future. Don't try to tell me that in the 1940s love and drugs, and the generally not giving a stuff about anything attitude was running rampant in middle schools and high schools.

What about Canada, what about the US? We have government run companies, like Amtrak and the USPS. Isn't that what socialism is? Also the whole cold war part made no sense, they were fed propaganda saying it was bad and thats what they believed. What proof do you have that a greater percentage of kids don't give a stuff and do drugs more. Honestly most people talking about how this generation sucks and what not looks at previous generations with rose colored spectacles, and it really pisses me off.

Dodger is a hipster. Now go read my other post in this topic.

First off, yes, there ARE companies ran by the government, and I should have worded that differently, we actually have a mixed market system. But that beats the hell out of ALL companies being controlled by the government who can set prices and choose what to sell.