Guy writes a satirical feminist article, and a feminist website published it

[Swat 3]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/loveual_dimorphism#Humans (don't click if you don't wanna see little man pee pee!)

Biologically males and females are not equal.

Males and females will never be equal. Sure, it may seem that females are "lesser" than males but I have never, EVER seen an example in my life where a girl was treated unfairly and cried about it with the reason that it was because she was female.

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[Hiok1998]

never, EVER seen an example in my life where a girl was treated unfairly and cried about it with the reason that it was because she was female.

http://www.tumblr.com/

[Swat 3]

where I live silly

the internet is a bad example because if you can't handle someone calling you say, bossy, you have other problems.
I am just going to put that loveual dimorphism right there and leave this thread.

[childofdarkness016]

You've already got my thesis wrong. My thesis is that anyone who believes that they are treated as lesser than the value given to them by society is stupid, regardless of anything.

Then why didn't you phrase it as such? That has a completely different meaning that how you phrased it earlier and somewhat has a logical basis; however, it doesn't apply to Feminism. Women, from a worldwide perspective, are valued less. They don't simply "view" it as such. It's a fact that anyone can see objectively.

You've already got my thesis wrong. My thesis is that anyone who believes that they are treated as lesser than the value given to them by society is stupid, regardless of anything.
Here's an example: Meg Whitman. Meg Whitman is a business executive and politician. She has smashed through any and any "glass ceiling" in existence and shown people that women can do things that 99.9% of men can not.

Here's another example: Barrack Obama. You can't tell me that there isn't still racial prejudice, and a black man becoming president really makes an example out of the things blacks can do. Granted, him being a horrible president doesn't help the cause, but that's kind of irrelevant.

I didn't mean silent as in idle. I meant silent as in using actions to make change instead of words. Telling someone you're better than they think won't change anything, showing them will change everything.

Neither of those examples are really changes, but either way, you are right in that actions speak louder than words. What you are wrong about, however, that people who "sit and complain" are achieving nothing. Raising awareness of an issue can sometimes be the only way of making change. I can't change the way people think, but if I point out, with evidence and persuasiveness, I can eventually do so. Actions may be louder than words, but words still make a noise. Not everyone can be the leading activist in an issue, and though there are many "silent supporters" of feminism who sit on their tumblr, there are also people in charge and that are making actual, more direct changes. Mind you, I am aware of the fact that there are dumb feminists on Tumblr, but there are always going to be stupid strawhatted radicals in every movement.

I don't view humans as any more important than any other tool. Go ahead and say I'm edgy or whatever, but I don't. Arguing that humans have infinite value because of their emotions is just about the weakest argument you could make towards me. Emotions are a dime a dozen, and I couldn't care less how happy other people are. If they wanna be happier, then they need to make themselves happier, not sit around on blogs and post about how shiftily they're treated. If you hate your job, leave it and find a new one. If you hate your social status, do something to change it. Don't sit around and complain.

Fine, you're unable of seeing the difference between a human and tool. That, however, does not change my argument. It just prevents you from understanding that gender equality (the lack thereof, of course) is an issue.

You can't just "make yourself happier," or "do something to change your social status," and expect change. This attitude people hold is slowing us down from making progress. We, as humans, are a social species, and are therefore supposed to work together to solve an issue. A single entity, be it a person or group, cannot expect to make change without support. People in power still need to be persuaded, as those are the people who are actually able to make the final decision.

Sitting around and complaining, contrary to popular belief, is still part of a passive change. Raising awareness is always the beginning of solving a problem.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/loveual_dimorphism#Humans (don't click if you don't wanna see little man pee pee!)

Biologically males and females are not equal.

Males and females will never be equal. Sure, it may seem that females are "lesser" than males but I have never, EVER seen an example in my life where a girl was treated unfairly and cried about it with the reason that it was because she was female.

What!??? Women are shorter than men during adulthood? This is a major injustice that needs to be fixed!! WomenSameHeightAsMen2014!!!

Biological differences are irrelevant in this argument for the most part. The only time it ever arises during a feminist argument is whether or not women should be allowed to participate in the military, which even then, it's irrelevant. The fact is that women are objectively equal to men, aside from several biological differences. But, we aren't cavemen anymore. Being able to carry a heavier lift or having more blood cells, for example, are not as relevant in modern society. What matters most is brain power, which the article you sent even proves my point: men and women are intellectually equal and therefore should be treated equally in the eyes of societies.

[Swat 3]

Extreme feminists don't help though, lol.
(I decided to come back!)

[childofdarkness016]

Extreme feminists don't help though, lol.
(I decided to come back!)

absolutely true

but people seem to ignore the fact that radfems are the minority because radical groups are always louder

[DrenDran]

feminists sure are dumb lol

[dudeman162]

[$trinick]

What you are wrong about, however, that people who "sit and complain" are achieving nothing. Raising awareness of an issue can sometimes be the only way of making change. I can't change the way people think, but if I point out, with evidence and persuasiveness, I can eventually do so. Actions may be louder than words, but words still make a noise.

Again, telling someone that they are wrong isn't going to achieve anything. Showing them they are wrong is the only way they will change. I personally don't view women as inherently less than men, but if I did, you telling me they're equal wouldn't change anything.

You can't just "make yourself happier," or "do something to change your social status," and expect change. This attitude people hold is slowing us down from making progress. We, as humans, are a social species, and are therefore supposed to work together to solve an issue. A single entity, be it a person or group, cannot expect to make change without support. People in power still need to be persuaded, as those are the people who are actually able to make the final decision.

This I pretty much completely disagree with. You can totally make yourself happier. You can do something to raise yourself up the social ladder. I'm a firm believer that you can do anything you put your mind to (within reason, of course) and my issue is not with women that do things against the norm, but with people who use words instead of actions to institute change.

Earlier I said people in the civil rights movement were dumb. My point wasn't to be tribal, I was actually banking on someone challenging that statement and saying "how?" It's been fifty years since that movement, and black people still aren't viewed on the same level as white people by society as a whole. The reason is that while complaining loud enough may have caused legal change that enabled blacks to progress through society, it didn't change the actual society. It's been all the actions that have been taken during the past 50 years that have changed society. It's been the black people that have gotten themselves into power, the black people that have been hard, dependable workers, and the black people who have shown their mettle that have caused societal change.

[childofdarkness016]

Again, telling someone that they are wrong isn't going to achieve anything. Showing them they are wrong is the only way they will change. I personally don't view women as inherently less than men, but if I did, you telling me they're equal wouldn't change anything.

OK, great, but you seem to be refusing to see how the other side has been attempting to persuade you. You claim that no one is showing you what's wrong, so let me put it in bullet form, since that might be easier to understand than paragraph form (mind you, I'm not doing this to be patronizing).

• Women are expected to fulfill what is viewed by society a lesser gender role. By taking care of the kids, making dinner, and providing for their husband, women are placed in the lesser, more passive gender role.
• Within narrative media, such as movies, books, and video games, women are often placed in less significant roles than men, in addition to often being loveualized. It's progressively becoming less and less of an issue because of feminism (shocker, I know), but remnants of this are still extant.
  
  Compare the number of female protagonists or characters with active roles within mainstream video games (video games because there was less time for feminists to affect the general direction of video games, yet it's still a modern form of storytelling) versus their male counterparts. You'll notice that the number is greatly in favor of men. Now, to worsen this, ask yourself, "How many of these characters are loveualized?" Ask yourself this for both men and women, just to counter MRAs (not saying you're one, whether or not you are one) who insist men are mistreated equally. The number of positive female representation will dwindle, yet there should be little effect on men. The same nearly applies to books and movies, but as there are more women and feminists in those creative fields, the numbers are much more equal.
• Being akin to a woman is considered derogatory. If someone calls a man "lady-like" or compares him to a girl, it's an insult. A man is shunned for walking around in a skirt, yet a woman receives less stigma for being manlier by wearing masculine clothing, such as jeans or sweaters. I can understand if you (specifically, not just anyone) don't see this as an issue, but it's wrong because it shames girls from being girls, in addition to shaming boys from being themselves if they are more effeminate than society wants. Obviously, this doesn't affect you, but hopefully you'll have a little compassion and realize that people don't like being told they can't be themselves, nor is it just.
  

There, is that clear enough for you? Society values women less than men, whether it's intentional or subconscious. There are more examples, but I recommend you do research into this if you aren't content with this information. I can't spell out everything for you, unfortunately.

This I pretty much completely disagree with. You can totally make yourself happier. You can do something to raise yourself up the social ladder. I'm a firm believer that you can do anything you put your mind to (within reason, of course) and my issue is not with women that do things against the norm, but with people who use words instead of actions to institute change.

This is another debate. I will mention that bringing about this change, as you say, is possible if you put your mind to it. That, however, still requires support from those above, so you aren't exactly making the change. You are raising awareness of an issue and then expecting someone else with more power than you to effect change, which means you are making change. The key difference is that it's indirect.

Earlier I said people in the civil rights movement were dumb. My point wasn't to be tribal, I was actually banking on someone challenging that statement and saying "how?" It's been fifty years since that movement, and black people still aren't viewed on the same level as white people by society as a whole. The reason is that while complaining loud enough may have caused legal change that enabled blacks to progress through society, it didn't change the actual society. It's been all the actions that have been taken during the past 50 years that have changed society. It's been the black people that have gotten themselves into power, the black people that have been hard, dependable workers, and the black people who have shown their mettle that have caused societal change.

No one is calling you tribal; you're implying you have some sort of latent insecurity of being tribal. That's beside the point, though.

Nothing is going to force society to change the way it views the world. Changing laws is not going to do anything for that, and people will often ignore evidence that contradicts their reasoning. Those POC could not have gotten into power without the works of Dr. Martin Luther King Jr., contrary to what you insist. With his activism, people have been able to make passive changes; therefore, it is both activism and passivism that is making changes.

[ResonKinetic]

old feminists: good

national socialist feminists: bad

[DrenDran]

lack of laws against paying someone less if they're female (I didn't think this was really a thing but it apparently is)

There are laws for this though.
And they shouldn't exist.
I've argued this before, it's not the governments place to micro-manage companies and how much they want to pay their employees.

The fact is that women are objectively equal to men, aside from several biological differences.

"They're equal except for differences."
I literally laughed out loud here.

The differences aren't just physical, they're mental. Women and men think differently.

[childofdarkness016]

The differences aren't just physical, they're mental. Women and men think differently.

biological

i said biological

thinking is a biological function

Either way, the link Swat 3 sent was about the physical differences of the two genders.

By saying what I said, I stated that those differences are irrelevant. They don't add or detract value from either gender. Also, just because people think differently, that doesn't mean they should be treated differently. Everyone thinks differently. We might as well oppress the people who don't think the way we like, right???

[DrenDran]

biological

i said biological

thinking is a biological function

Either way, the link Swat 3 sent was about the physical differences of the two genders.

By saying what I said, I stated that those differences are irrelevant. They don't add or detract value from either gender. Also, just because people think differently, that doesn't mean they should be treated differently. Everyone thinks differently. We might as well oppress the people who don't think the way we like, right???

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/love_and_intelligence
Certain qualities aren't appropriate for certain roles and tasks.
E.g. someone who is more emotional should not be considered for a serious leadership position.
This isn't to say a woman could never lead, but that it is more of a risk to have a woman lead than a man.

I love how the typical egalitarian argument typically has two phases:
1. Saying that everyone is equal, then being proven wrong, then:
2. Saying that the differences don't matter, then when refuted throwing a hissy fit and calling their conversation partner a bigot.

[childofdarkness016]

Certain qualities aren't appropriate for certain roles and tasks.

I love how the typical egalitarian argument typically has two phases:
1. Saying that everyone is equal, then being proven wrong, then:
2. Saying that the differences don't matter, then throwing a hissy fit and calling their conversation partner a bigot.

i never called you a bigot, nor have i thrown a hissy fit

Those differences are irrelevant. Wow, men are taller than women and therefore are physically stronger! That means that men should be the only ones to vote and work! Women have more white blood cells, so they should be the ones who cook dinner and do nothing outside of the house! We're civilized people. These differences are negligible and  have no relevance when it comes to rights. We're advanced enough to provide medication to sick people, so having a better immune system so you don't get children sick is no longer an important quality for women. Work for men no longer requires brute strength for the most part, so why does having more testosterone give you the ability to be taken seriously and get a job? If a woman, who is undeniably weaker than a man, chooses to work in a job that does require strength, than that's her decision. Why stop her? If she's hurt because of it, that's her loss. If not, then that further proves that these biological differences are no longer relevant.

The cases above are the only instances I can think of in which these biological differences are actually relevant, but since we've progressed, we've created ways to bypass this. This is the modern day. We don't need to dehumanize each other over irrelevant matters.

oh you edited your post

give me a second

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/love_and_intelligence
Certain qualities aren't appropriate for certain roles and tasks.
E.g. someone who is more emotional should not be considered for a serious leadership position.
This isn't to say a woman could never lead, but that it is more of a risk to have a woman lead than a man.

are you really using this argument

Men get angry more often, and people can't think clearly when they're angry! Clearly, men are unsuitable leaders when compared to women, whose motherly instincts help them lead in a more caring yet protective manner.