Super Smash Bros. For Wii U & 3DS: MEWTWO CODES GOIN OUT

[ultimamax]

p sure you can thank nintendo for no project m too

If you think about it it's the nicest thing they could have done without compromising their business interests. They want to get involved in competitive smash. But if they even acknowledge Project M's existence, either implicitly or explicitly, they'll have intellectual property hell to face. Just be glad they haven't C&D'd it, right?

Besides I doubt Nintendo will get involved for long.

[Ad Bot]

[Niff]

It would be a real cash cow if Nintendo made a "Competitive Edition" for every smash game, so beginners can have fun and competitive players can also not be a whiny bitch about how the game doesn't have exploitable glitches

doubt it will happen though

[ultimamax]

It would be a real cash cow if Nintendo made a "Competitive Edition" for every smash game, so beginners can have fun and competitive players can also not be a whiny bitch about how the game doesn't have exploitable glitches

doubt it will happen though

Actually, most competitive players don't want a game with glitches. Most of the beef with Brawl/Smash 4 is that it's much floatier/higher hitlag/higher aerial landing lag/easier to recover. SM4SH and Brawl are slower games. (not necessarily a bad thing)

The competitive market is too small to make an entirely separate version of the game. I feel like Melee was a fun party game on top of being very fun to play competitively, so I don't understand Sakurai's digression to the Brawl/Sm4sh style engine.

[Niff]

Actually, most competitive players don't want a game with glitches. Most of the beef with Brawl/Smash 4 is that it's much floatier/higher hitlag/higher aerial landing lag/easier to recover. SM4SH and Brawl are slower games. (not necessarily a bad thing)

The competitive market is too small to make an entirely separate version of the game. I feel like Melee was a fun party game on top of being very fun to play competitively, so I don't understand Sakurai's digression to the Brawl/Sm4sh style engine.

for beginners remember

too many people are high teir good at melee that a new engine will most likely be new user friendly

[ultimamax]

for beginners remember

too many people are high teir good at melee that a new engine will most likely be new user friendly

I personally don't care whether Sakurai makes the next game more Melee-esque. Melee was a happy accident. Any attempt to emulate it would likely fall flat in comparison.

However, they could make it easier for beginners to get good at the so called Melee 2 by lowering the technical skill required. Melee has insane tech requirements. The lag cancel window is 7 frames. (imo they should remove l cancelling and halve the landing lag of all moves automatically) Fox's short hop window is two frames. (That's 32 milliseconds. What the forget.)

Remove the technical barriers and you have a fast, brutal competitive game that's more accessible, that can also be a fun party game as well.

All this to pander to the competitive audience is still asking too much though.

[Niff]

I personally don't care whether Sakurai makes the next game more Melee-esque. Melee was a happy accident. Any attempt to emulate it would likely fall flat in comparison.

However, they could make it easier for beginners to get good at the so called Melee 2 by lowering the technical skill required. Melee has insane tech requirements. The lag cancel window is 7 frames. (imo they should remove l cancelling and halve the landing lag of all moves automatically) Fox's short hop window is two frames. (That's 32 milliseconds. What the forget.)

Remove the technical barriers and you have a fast, brutal competitive game that's more accessible, that can also be a fun party game as well.

All this to pander to the competitive audience is still asking too much though.

very true, however for people that are "Nintendo age" (4 or 5 to 8 or 9) will probably still have a hard time keeping up with the competitive smash players, personally I find friend-to-friend matches a lot more funner and a lot less pressured because of how things are. In fact, on a for glory match, I got so anxious about winning that my heart rate skyrocketed, I dunno if that's something else but still, even when I fought WaffleCake I started second guessing myself and loosing my grip on good combos. That might just be me being me. In short, a smooth mix between melee and brawl speed would be good for competitive smash and beginners which in a sense is what smash 4 is, at least to me.

[KoopaScooper]

In fact, on a for glory match, I got so anxious about winning that my heart rate skyrocketed

That sounds like more of a personal problem. You should probably get that checked out.

[Niff]

That sounds like more of a personal problem. You should probably get that checked out.

bleh, I was probably over reacting

I was also tired

[ultimamax]

very true, however for people that are "Nintendo age" (4 or 5 to 8 or 9) will probably still have a hard time keeping up with the competitive smash players, personally I find friend-to-friend matches a lot more funner and a lot less pressured because of how things are. In fact, on a for glory match, I got so anxious about winning that my heart rate skyrocketed, I dunno if that's something else but still, even when I fought WaffleCake I started second guessing myself and loosing my grip on good combos. That might just be me being me. In short, a smooth mix between melee and brawl speed would be good for competitive smash and beginners which in a sense is what smash 4 is, at least to me.

There is no way to make an 8 year old good at a video game like Smash, unless you make the game based on luck. An 11 year old will get bodied by someone with minimal experience who's two or more years old than them.

The whole point of opening up the competitive side is that, yes, competitive players will be able to body most inexperienced players. But, by lowering the technical skill required, the beginners will at least have a chance. Like if you put up a beginner against M2K and he was wavedashing and l-cancelling everywhere, the beginner wouldn't know what he's doing or how. But by changing the technical skill required, a competitive player wouldn't have "inside knowledge", they'd just have more experience with the game, y'know? So it wouldn't be so daunting to get good at it.

[Niff]

There is no way to make an 8 year old good at a video game like Smash, unless you make the game based on luck. An 11 year old will get bodied by someone with minimal experience who's two or more years old than them.

The whole point of opening up the competitive side is that, yes, competitive players will be able to body most inexperienced players. But, by lowering the technical skill required, the beginners will at least have a chance. Like if you put up a beginner against M2K and he was wavedashing and l-cancelling everywhere, the beginner wouldn't know what he's doing or how. But by changing the technical skill required, a competitive player wouldn't have "inside knowledge", they'd just have more experience with the game, y'know? So it wouldn't be so daunting to get good at it.

that's the point I was trying to get at yes. I agree 100%

[otto-san]

The main thing about a fighting game is that it has to provide a portal for new players to a) be able to git gud, and b) be interested in gitting gud. Smash already does both of these things very well, likely because they want to do it well. Like it or not, the spammable moves make beginners feel good and make them want to play more and get better. When they reach higher levels of play, they realise that they can be more generally effective by using more clever strategies.

The competitive community is still always going to be important in any major fighting game, but Smash's casual audience is certainly not invaluable. I think the new online modes will really encourage a lot of players to try and get to a higher level of mastery which normally only the competitive community would try to reach.

[Niff]

The main thing about a fighting game is that it has to provide a portal for new players to a) be able to git gud, and b) be interested in gitting gud. Smash already does both of these things very well, likely because they want to do it well. Like it or not, the spammable moves make beginners feel good and make them want to play more and get better. When they reach higher levels of play, they realise that they can be more generally effective by using more clever strategies.

The competitive community is still always going to be important in any major fighting game, but Smash's casual audience is certainly not invaluable. I think the new online modes will really encourage a lot of players to try and get to a higher level of mastery which normally only the competitive community would try to reach.

and this is why I hate Street Fighter competitive play, theres usually only updated graphics and rosters to new games, no mechanics are added most of the time and the same combos can be passed on from say SF3 to SF4

[otto-san]

The traditional button combo system is really hard for beginners to get into without an extensive and well-made tutorial. I got Skullgirls recently and I was pretty impressed with their tutoring system. I just have way too much trouble with those directional button combos, even with a joystick. My first fighting games were of this breed, but they never had fantastic explanations on anything. I learned with time as the story mode got harder, but I never felt like the mastery level was attainable.

[Moriarty]

playing people again if they want on 3ds or wii u
kooopz is my nintendo ID
my friend code is a couple pages back

[Zanaran2]

The real problems I have with competitive players and all those obscure strategies is that it just shows how averse people are to change by trying to find those strategies. If you want Melee, play Melee. Not hard.