Author Topic: "Poll: Should officer Darren Wilson, who shot Michael Brown, be arrested?"  (Read 68990 times)

nightfox, are you saying, even if it was a complete accident you were trying to immobilize them and they die and you are traumatized by it, if you kill someone, that automatically makes you enjoy it?
why are you trying to immobilize someone with a gun in the first place? guns are for killing
but no, that's not what I'm saying. there's a difference between accidentally killing someone and murder. however, if you accidentally kill someone with a gun, that's still criminal negligence, and you're hardly better than someone who actually intended to kill someone

The one thing I don't understand in this controversy is how anyone can think that Darren Wilson shouldn't be at least prosecuted for the murder of Michael Brown. Like, he killed him and there's no definitive evidence that it was out of self-defense. Under this kind of paradigm, a cop could essentially kill anyone they want on the street, and if no one witnessed it, claim 'self defense' and avoid prosecution.

I can understand why people think that it might not have been murder. Obviously I think that opinion is dumb, but I can at least expect some people to believe that it was a justified killing. However, there is literally no excuse for the fact that he has walked free for months without facing any kind of prosecution for killing an unarmed teenager for no apparent reason.

why are you trying to immobilize someone with a gun in the first place? guns are for killing
but no, that's not what I'm saying. there's a difference between accidentally killing someone and murder. however, if you accidentally kill someone with a gun, that's still criminal negligence, and you're hardly better than someone who actually intended to kill someone
I'm getting a strong "killing people in general is bad" vibe from you which I totally understand but I don't understand the whole "if you kill anyone with a gun ever that automatically means you enjoy it" thing. Because that's definitely not true.

I'm getting a strong "killing people in general is bad" vibe from you which I totally understand but I don't understand the whole "if you kill anyone with a gun ever that automatically means you enjoy it" thing. Because that's definitely not true.
if you are trying to kill someone, then there's no other explanation for it. unless you just liked the idea of them being dead, there's not any reason you'd want someone to die

why are you trying to immobilize someone with a gun in the first place? guns are for killing
but no, that's not what I'm saying. there's a difference between accidentally killing someone and murder. however, if you accidentally kill someone with a gun, that's still criminal negligence, and you're hardly better than someone who actually intended to kill someone
If you don't like the government paying men with guns then go protest the us military. Their job is basically to kill people unlike said police.

If you don't like the government paying men with guns then go protest the us military. Their job is basically to kill people unlike said police.
and I honestly think it's absurd that there are literally people who get paid, by the government, to murder people


Race SHOULD be irrelevant. However, society likes to blame racism for everything.
yeah it's pretty annoying how the government doesn't just treat everyone equal

i heard on the news about how some companies didn't have a legal amount of minority employees
it doesn't loving matter

if you are trying to kill someone, then there's no other explanation for it. unless you just liked the idea of them being dead, there's not any reason you'd want someone to die
Let's say you had the chance to shoot down one or more of the planes that hit the twin towers. I sure as hell would, that doesn't mean I enjoy it, I just want to save the thousands of people that lost their lives in the tragic attacks.

Or what if you've been kidnapped and the only way to get out alive is to kill your captor, whose holding you for a ridiculous ransom you and your family cannot pay. You don't necessarily enjoy killing him, you enjoy being free and not being dead.

Let's say you had the chance to shoot down one or more of the planes that hit the twin towers. I sure as hell would, that doesn't mean I enjoy it, I just want to save the thousands of people that lost their lives in the tragic attacks.
well, no. first of all, because of causality stuff. if I stopped it, then I never would have had a reason to go back in time, and it would have happened, in which case, I would've gone back in time to stop it, then I'd have no reason to go back, and so on. who knows what would happen if that happened, but whatever it was, I wouldn't wanna be responsible for it
and even ignoring paradoxes, that was a really big event, and changing what happened then would likely change far too much in the present for it to be considered ethical. which is actually the causality stuff that I mentioned earlier, before I changed my mind about what I was gonna say first
Or what if you've been kidnapped and the only way to get out alive is to kill your captor, whose holding you for a ridiculous ransom you and your family cannot pay. You don't necessarily enjoy killing him, you enjoy being free and not being dead.
I am like 99% sure the police or some other group would help a family that couldn't pay a ransom. but even if not, I'd have no way of knowing they couldn't pay, so...

well, no. first of all, because of causality stuff. if I stopped it, then I never would have had a reason to go back in time, and it would have happened, in which case, I would've gone back in time to stop it, then I'd have no reason to go back, and so on. who knows what would happen if that happened, but whatever it was, I wouldn't wanna be responsible for it
and even ignoring paradoxes, that was a really big event, and changing what happened then would likely change far too much in the present for it to be considered ethical. which is actually the causality stuff that I mentioned at first, before I changed my mind about what I was gonna say firstI am like 99% sure the police or some other group would help a family that couldn't pay a ransom. but even if not, I'd have no way of knowing they couldn't pay, so...
This is some class A level bullstuff right here lol.
"let me just ramble on irrelevantly to avoid the questions I am being asked. That'll show them that I'm right!"

well, no. first of all, because of causality stuff. if I stopped it, then I never would have had a reason to go back in time, and it would have happened, in which case, I would've gone back in time to stop it, then I'd have no reason to go back, and so on. who knows what would happen if that happened, but whatever it was, I wouldn't wanna be responsible for it
and even ignoring paradoxes, that was a really big event, and changing what happened then would likely change far too much in the present for it to be considered ethical. which is actually the causality stuff that I mentioned at first, before I changed my mind about what I was gonna say first

I am like 99% sure the police or some other group would help a family that couldn't pay a ransom. but even if not, I'd have no way of knowing they couldn't pay, so...
I'm not saying time travel, I'm saying a hypothetical scenario where you were (past tense) in a position where you could do that. And who says the kidnapper is going to actually give you back after the ransom is paid? If the cops can't find you, you're on your own.

This is some class A level bullstuff right here lol.
"let me just ramble on irrelevantly to avoid the questions I am being asked. That'll show them that I'm right!"
it isn't irrelevant?? I'm pretty sure the first hypothetical situation was about changing the past, which would have a lot of moral aspects to it, that I assumed he was asking about. except, he just now said it wasn't about time travel, so oh well
I'm not saying time travel, I'm saying a hypothetical scenario where you were (past tense) in a position where you could do that.
well, then I'd just evacuate the world trade center and the areas around it. and if possible, get in contact with someone on the planes and let them know what's going on. a plane full of passengers will certainly be able to overwhelm the hijackers, and it's probably not terribly unlikely that at least one person on the plane would be able to land it relatively safely, even if they had to be walked through it by another pilot. that's not even a hard hypothetical question
And who says the kidnapper is going to actually give you back after the ransom is paid? If the cops can't find you, you're on your own.
them, probably. but I really doubt they'd be alone, and I don't think I'd be able to kill someone who was able to kidnap me anyway. outside of that, at least one person would die anyway, so it might as well be me

if you are trying to kill someone, then there's no other explanation for it. unless you just liked the idea of them being dead, there's not any reason you'd want someone to die
In your view that you're expressing, that actively killing someone (and thereby wanting to kill someone at that time) means you must enjoy killing, in order to do it, you're forgetting the idea that you can kill out of necessity.

You may scoff that this is an unfair comparison, but it's not;
I do not like baked beans. I can not stand the taste of them, and would happily never have them in my presence, or be in a situation where I am expected to eat them.
Were I in a situation however whereby I was trapped somewhere (imagine what you like, whether it's a flood, or snowstorm, or nuclear holocaust) and food supplies were running very low, and the ONLY food that remained were tins of baked beans, I would consume them. The taste would completely dissatisfy me, and I would take no pleasure from eating them and would not enjoy the situation. I would still eat them however because it is NECESSARY for me to live.


Parallel to this is the situation where I am attacked.
In my struggle to defend myself from the attacker, I am forced due to his sheer determination to do me harm (or even kill me) to injure him to the point of killing him.
This could be because I beat him to death (this doesn't necessitate him being incapacitated and me continuing to hit him, where you might assume I continue out of enjoyment), or I stab him, or I strangle him, or even that I shoot him.
I don't have to enjoy killing the man to do it. I need only to feel the necessity to kill him, in order to protect myself (or even my loved ones, or posessions).
There's also the fact that the natural Fight-or-Flight mechanism takes place, where I reactively fight without real awareness of what I'm doing, due to the sheer pumping of adrenaline through my body. It's an animalistic response, the exact same as two lions fighting. And even though it is animalistic, we as humans can still use tools in this moment of reflex, which includes knives and guns.

It is not at all required that you have to enjoy the killing of another person in order to do so.
I'm not sure I can convince you of that, but I've tried.
But I am very happy to say that I am certain that were you in a panic-driven life-or-death situation with an adversary, you would try to cause serious harm, and you would not be in complete control of when you stop. You would fight until you could no more, or your opponent could no more, even if your opponent fought to their death.


a plane full of passengers will certainly be able to overwhelm the hijackers, and it's probably not terribly unlikely that at least one person on the plane would be able to land it relatively safely, even if they had to be walked through it by another pilot.
This isn't actually all that likely.
People afraid of gunmen will stay down, even if they vastly outnumber their hijackers. Sure they could all run at the hijackers and take them down, but they all know that some of them could be killed, and most people won't take the chance that it's them.

As for landing a plane, pretty much impossible.
You NEED to have experience on a commercial passenger jet to have a hope in hell of flying the thing and landing it.
There have been studies and experiments where people who already have training to fly light aircraft have been guided to try and fly/land a passenger jet simulator, and they've failed miserably. (I'm not going to look these up now because it's very late, but they're out there if you're interested).

Your alerting people on the plane may do absolutely nothing, particularly if the hijacking has already started to take place.

The poll was for the ARREST of this police officer, not the death lol. Personally it's no big deal to me. I'm all for it.