Off Topic > Off Topic
refugees in sweden are magically """"comatose"""" when informed of deportation
Planr:
--- Quote from: SeventhSandwich on June 16, 2017, 07:10:07 PM ---Yeah but you also don't go on the forums and make fun of the homeless man either. Nobody's asking you to uproot yourself and become a humanitarian worker, just don't split on people with stufftier lives than you.
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Speaking strictly in terms of America here: Most homeless people/panhandlers are homeless by choice you know. It's incredibly easy to make money just standing on the street pretending to be homeless. Many people that do it for a living make up to 50 or more dollars a day. They stay out there because the money's good, and they'd rather live off that than go to a homeless shelter and have to go through the long process of trying to earn their own living. Easier to just beg and get money for free and eat/drink whatever they want with little consequence.
It's a highly profitable method of getting money, and often done fraudulently.
And before you say i'm making this up, yes, this is a very real and very common thing:
http://www.fox19.com/story/18610481/aurora-homeless-shelter-director-says-cardboard-panhandling-is-scam
http://www.lowellsun.com/news/ci_29777946/homeless-signs-say-scam-many-cry
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4534812/Virginia-woman-fake-homeless-video-arrested.html
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbcDdPsQeMA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EWdoGtdN_7g
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CynYgP8PcWc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdpnEac1cCY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aq2YWdbCtO8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FOfPgezVn3M
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XyKiQm-yUwk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=seUmRXn_1qY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t23jkt9OQRs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zoTlWdFKXY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBDCPDqdH-Y
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iXBNHZrbuXE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T-gv6SldTr0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUAe1FYeHAU
I would never give money to a homeless person on the streets, (1) because they have easy access to homeless shelters in 99% of situations and (2) because they're most likely scammers/not really homeless. I have no compassion or sympathy for them.
Deus Ex:
--- Quote from: Planr on June 16, 2017, 08:50:47 PM ----snip-
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I've seen enough "homeless" people with fresh, clean clothes outside my local McDonalds to know better. Hell, I saw this one guy with his god damn collar pressed and ironed better than mine. The forget dude
SeventhSandwich:
--- Quote from: Planr on June 16, 2017, 08:50:47 PM ---Speaking strictly in terms of America here: Most homeless people/panhandlers are homeless by choice you know. It's incredibly easy to make money just standing on the street pretending to be homeless. Many people that do it for a living make up to 50 or more dollars a day. They stay out there because the money's good, and they'd rather live off that than go to a homeless shelter and have to go through the long process of trying to earn their own living. Easier to just beg and get money for free and eat/drink whatever they want with little consequence.
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You often say things that are bullstuff out of ignorance rather than malice, so I'll just explain why homeless people aren't choosing to be homeless in terms of numbers and facts. Take it more as helpful information rather than an 'attack' on your position.
First of all, many people who are homeless have a mental illness. 25% of homeless people suffer from a diagnosed, severe mental illness. In the general populace, it's only 6%, which means there's a clear, significant correlation between being mentally ill and being homeless. The same fact sheet I linked talks about why mental illness makes it harder for homeless people to live normal lives.
--- Quote ---Serious mental illnesses disrupt people's ability to carry out essential aspects of daily life, such as self care and household management. Mental illnesses may also prevent people from forming and maintaining stable relationships or cause people to misinterpret others' guidance and react irrationally... As a result of these factors and the stresses of living with a mental disorder, people with mentally illnesses are much more likely to become homeless than the general population (Library Index, 2009)
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Second, many people who are homeless are substance dependent. 38% of homeless people were dependent on alcohol, and 26% abused other drugs. Because they have substance addictions, it is extremely difficult for homeless people to gain stable employment and live normal lives. These addictions are usually comorbid with mental illnesses like BPD and depression, and they often take drugs as a way of self-medicating for their illness. Rehab is obviously not an option because it's prohibitively expensive.
Third, there is actual research debunking the claim that panhandlers are scam artists trying to get rich. They surveyed hundreds of people in San Francisco who were panhandling and found that 26% of them were veterans, 82% of them were homeless, 62% were disabled, 32% had drug addictions, 60% make less than $25 a day, and 94% use the money for food. These are not people trying to live the 'easy life' by begging for money. They have forgeted up lives and probably no hope of ever making it off the streets alive. That being said, they also found 44% of the panhandlers used the money for drugs/alcohol, so it is acceptable if you don't want to give them money.
Planr:
In this case I can say with complete confidence that you're dead wrong.
I expected you'd probably pull up some obnoxious statistic/organization report and cite it as being the gold standard. Real experience and on-the-streets footage Annoying Oranges easily-misleading statistics drawn up in an office any day.
Homeless people who are genuinely down on their luck and drug addicts go to homeless shelters and churches to get the help they need. Fake homeless people stay on the streets and panhandle for money. It's really quite simple.
SeventhSandwich:
--- Quote from: Planr on June 16, 2017, 09:43:06 PM ---In this case I can say with complete confidence that you're dead wrong. Real experience and on-the-streets footage Annoying Oranges statistics drawn up in an office any day.
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So if a study showed most Christians are good people, but I say they're all tribals because I know 10 tribal Christians and can pull up Youtube videos with tribal Christians, you think that's good reasoning? You would be fine if I went on the forums and shat all over them because 'personal experience Annoying Oranges actual statistics'?
By the way, statistics are personal experiences. It's just that the person experiencing them isn't selling a narrative, talked to way more homeless people than are in the videos you linked, and wrote down what they found in great detail. It's not like scientists are just idiots in office buildings pulling numbers out of their asses. They're people surveying people in the street.
--- Quote from: Planr on June 16, 2017, 09:43:06 PM ---Homeless people who are genuinely down on their luck and drug addicts go to homeless shelters and churches to get the help they need. Fake homeless people stay on the streets and panhandle for money. It's really quite simple.
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Homeless shelters generally only offer temporary housing, and churches (some) will give you food. That doesn't solve 99% of the problems that cause cyclical homelessness.
Also, you, being church-going person, think that they're all frauds who are exploiting other people's kindness for money. Maybe that's a reason why homeless people are less receptive to the help given by the religious? Maybe because it comes with condescension and disdain?