Poll

How do you feel about raycast weapons?

I'd stick a raycast up my butt (Great)
They're alright (Good)
No opinion (Neutral)
They're bad (Bad)
They belong in hell (Terrible)

Author Topic: [POLL] How do you feel about raycast weapons?  (Read 6826 times)

to both  :cookieMonster:

but yeah i think its best not purely raycast. if you want to simulate fast projectiles you can in fact handle that through raycasts to break the projectile speed limit. but honestly no pack should be purely projectile or raycast as the most popular and well-received packs mix both by establishing a different purpose to each kind of gun.

raycast weapons don't hurt bots iirc which sucks, but otherwise i like them
I never have seen this problem before, though again as Block said, it is based on whoever made it.

They're great if done right
Nobody has done it right

Nobody has done it right

I disagree. Some of Bushido's quake weapons are pretty well done. Maybe not perfect, but they are going in the right direction imo.

Also, I'd like to pose an additional question:


What do you think of raycast melee weapons vs projectile-based melee weapons?

An example of raycasted melee would be bushido's old T+T melee weps. Example of projectile-based would be the default sword.

seems barely different

seems barely different

If default/slow playertypes, yes
But I've done quite a bit of testing with custom playertypes (namely in dueling scenarios), and the differences between raycasting vs projectile melee are pretty huge imo

Yeah, there's effectively no difference between raycast-based and projectile-based melee weapons, so one is not better than the other. The best way to innovate melee weapons is with a system that gives it some sort of radius or path damage as opposed to being a glorified gun that shoots invisible projectiles.

If default/slow playertypes, yes
But I've done quite a bit of testing with custom playertypes (namely in dueling scenarios), and the differences between raycasting vs projectile melee are pretty huge imo
What differences did you see?

The main difference is that projectile based melee weapons are (in general) negatively affected by the player movement. Even with inherited velocity.
Essentially, it boils down to the fact that you need to lead your target if the weapon is projectile based, which you technically still do need to do (sometimes) with raycasted melee, but in general it's much less of an issue.

Blockland has a funny minimum lifetime limit of 100ms for projectiles, which means that the most feasible way to fine-tune the range of a melee weapon is to adjust the projectile speed.
Shorter ranged projectile melee weapons therefore get hit doubly hard, because their range is bad along with a slower moving projectile. This is especially noticeable when you are chasing your opponent (with fast playertypes).
In general, projectile-based melee weapons require more practice to use well.

Raycasted melee don't have this problem because they hit near-instantly. Bushido's melee weapons have a pretty short range, and they still work well and quite easy to use, for example, even against fast targets, or as a fast playertype.


My bug mods are a pretty good example of how much the player speed effects the weapon. It's generally very easy to hit things with the small, slow bugs, even though their melee ranges are very short (slow projectiles). Meanwhile, the faster bugs can be very hard to use properly because they go so fast compared to their melee weapon projectiles (even with much faster projectiles).

At some point I'm probably going to switch most if not all of the bugs' melee attacks to raycast and see how things go. But I predict that the balance of the bugs will explode to pretty OP levels once that happens.


Yeah, there's effectively no difference between raycast-based and projectile-based melee weapons, so one is not better than the other. The best way to innovate melee weapons is with a system that gives it some sort of radius or path damage as opposed to being a glorified gun that shoots invisible projectiles.

Yeah, I'd love to see more interesting melee weapons tbh. I think that path/arc damage would be more interesting that radius, but it's pretty hard to implement and I'm not sure it has ever been done correctly in BL. I know that Lordician was attempting to make such a system at some point, but was having some funny vector issues (possibly engine bugs, can't remember).
I've been testing an attack that uses a radius check to deal damage, and the thing is ridiculously easy to hit with, even with a long windup time and relatively small range (it's basically the down-slam of a hammer weapon).
« Last Edit: January 03, 2018, 04:03:18 PM by ArmyUnit »

Melee weapons could benefit from firing multiple raycasts over the duration of the attack animation. When it hits a target for the first time, it stops firing raycasts. That way you don't need laser-guided pinpoint accuracy to hit a moving target that has more than 10 nanoseconds of latency, you just have to actually hit them with your weapon.

i like raycast cus projectiles are super slow

Melee weapons could benefit from firing multiple raycasts over the duration of the attack animation. When it hits a target for the first time, it stops firing raycasts. That way you don't need laser-guided pinpoint accuracy to hit a moving target that has more than 10 nanoseconds of latency, you just have to actually hit them with your weapon.

This is probably the best solution. Could have it fire the raycasts in a simple arc pattern even.

actually raycast weapons are great as long as the aim isn't perfect

actually raycast weapons are great as long as the aim isn't perfect
gravity cat's default style weapon pack sniper is horrendous tho

cant hit anything

How do you figure?
woops forgot to respond to this, but i prefer projectile weapons over raycasting usually cus it can be a lil more fun and satisfying to be able to track where someone's going to be rather than where they already are

there can be exceptions such as snipers but for the most part i like projectile weapons better :)