Author Topic: weapon_grenades - a whole 9 unoriginal grenades!  (Read 2340 times)

About time we get some new grenades in here. Very cool.

Conc is pretty weak imo. I get the idea of balancing, but if the max damage is only 88, then is it really a grenade?

thanks for the epic grenades

Conc is pretty weak imo. I get the idea of balancing, but if the max damage is only 88, then is it really a grenade?
thats 88 damage per player hit. if you throw it at a group of 3 people, it deals a total of 260 damage at once. thats powerful. you have to think of grenades as what they actually are meant to be- crowd control aoe, not instakill explosive throwing knives

in real life a grenade doesnt have that high of a chance to kill instantly. the concussion is usually absorbed into your legs and midsection and usually cripples infantry, leaving them to bleed out on the ground legless. in video games if you can dish out that much damage to people it just makes it that much easier to clean them up with a regular weapon (think csgo)
« Last Edit: August 16, 2020, 03:31:55 PM by PhantOS »

flash - blinds and deafens players longer depending on where they're looking(occasionally a few sounds slip through the deafening system but it works most of the time)
conc - standard explosive, deals up to 88dmg
electric - zaps any players in a pretty large radius and slows them a bit, deals 26dmg
frag - weaker conc but throws shrapnel, explosion deals up to 52dmg, shrapnel deals up to 60x19
gas - releases toxic gas which stays for 8.5s, deals up to 171dmg
molotov - bottle you can throw and burn people with, impact deals up to 40dmg, fire stays for 10s and deals up to around 220dmg + 15dmg afterburn
nail - weaker frag with stronger shrapnel, explosion deals up to 32dmg, shrapnel deals up to 50x33
smoke - releases black smoke that lasts for 20s
stick - sticky hand grenade, deals up to 118dmg
here's my official suggestion list for this. read/use/ignore it at your own discretion:

conc/stick: remove damage falloff if it already exists so it just deals flat damage to anyone caught in the radius.
reason: consistency in fights. lends more utility as a crowd control item by forcing targets to actually move a set distance away from each other in order to survive, pushing them out of cover so you can take better shots with other weapons. also makes it really powerful because you can lob it at a wall and cripple any enemies that are behind the wall and know exactly how badly damaged they were.

frag/nail: see other page. basically line of sight check instead of projectile damage.
reason: also consistency. frag grenades can be amazing tools on maps with a lot of cover, and are more fun to use because you have to think about where you throw them in order to maximize the lines of sight. in the presence of conc/stick, it will be underpowered as it stands, but with a bigger radius it can stand up on its own.

smoke/gas: combine into one item. just have the smoke do damage, but not a great amount. like crossing thru smoke should do up to 20-30 damage maximum
reason: both smoke and gas act as area denial and dynamic cover, preventing people from crossing into territory and allowing you to set up ambushes. if anyone is brave enough to push thru it, they'll have already taken a little bit of damage making them weaker. having two separate items that already have a good synergy together is dumb because then you need two inventory slots just to get the most out of both of them.

electric: less damage, more slowdown and radius
reason: as it stands electric grenade might be the best support grenade in this pack, and there's almost no other add-ons that offer wide radius slowdown debuffs. you don't even have to change it that much. with higher damage, electric will fill another area denial role and players who use it will feel more incentivized to just throw it at choke points, and targets will simply wait it out/avoid it. ideally it should be used as a well-timed sneak attack when targets are clumped together or need to cross a wide, open area with little cover, so these changes may make it more useful in that department.

molotov: widen spread of fire, lower damage significantly. make it so players who are on fire stay on fire for a while and can leave a trail of more fire wherever they walk.
reason: molotov and gas fill the same role as the area denial punishment already. this change will point it more towards the tech/anti-clump cluster grenade style of gameplay. wider fire spread means that you can throw it high on a vertical position like the top of a building and it will spread out onto the ground below, adding more vertical usage than any other grenade. the fire spreading/lingering burning guarantees that anyone hit is weakened and must scatter in order to avoid burning their teammates too. the fire trail also means that targets can like, jump over the fire in order to avoid it, making it more fun to fight against a molotov while also forcing them to go airborne and making them an easier target for almost every gun



conc/stick: remove damage falloff if it already exists so it just deals flat damage to anyone caught in the radius.
wouldn't this make them both too powerful?

frag/nail: see other page. basically line of sight check instead of projectile damage.
i'll make it so the 360° spread shrapnel is just decorative and as suggested by conan, instead fire like a shotgun at people nearby

smoke/gas: combine into one item. just have the smoke do damage, but not a great amount. like crossing thru smoke should do up to 20-30 damage maximum
will do later since the molotov makes gas redundant
i'll also make smoke use the gas grenade model and i'll recolor it to either black or purple instead of green

electric: less damage, more slowdown and radius
done, now deals 11dmg (was ~26) and halves the player's speed for around 5 seconds
should I lower its slowdown time?

molotov: widen spread of fire, lower damage significantly. make it so players who are on fire stay on fire for a while and can leave a trail of more fire wherever they walk.
lowered damage to 2.5dmg/128ms (was 5 i think) and made afterburn 2.5x as long
not too sure about afterburn leaving a fire trail
also fixed the spread on the fire, it was never meant to all just stay where it blew up
the spread was so high the fire just all instantly stuck to the ground
also added 20 fire projectiles

cluster grenade when

soon maybe

also might make c4



also thank you all for the feedback
very much appreciated

wouldn't this make them both too powerful?
conc should be your baseline for how every other grenade is balanced. i like to think of grenades as the ace in the hole utility item that you use to turn the battle in your favor at very specific times. on the flipside, the cook mechanic acts as a telegraph for grenades so people know as soon as you plan to throw it that they need to relocate in order to stay alive. most people won't even get caught in a conc blast radius unless they're not paying attention or they're not aware of your presence at all. 88 is a lot for a flat radius damage, but its not the damage that matters in grenades, it's the pressure that it applies in battle.

should I lower its slowdown time?
3 seconds is my suggestion but its up to you, it all depends on how you want people to use the grenade in combat. i envision the slowdown as an open area denial that can be used best in wide crossings like roads or fields where enemies can be made easier targets for pop damage guns like snipers or shotguns.

not too sure about afterburn leaving a fire trail
yea you're right, it is a little too gimmicky and might not have many practical applications in fights. good call

honestly i'm very biased towards the overwatch/tf2 style of gameplay where everything is well balanced and all items have a specific application and mechanic, so don't feel pressured to change anything on my accord. everyone who makes a weapon pack has their own vision on how it should be used in a server so even if you don't change anything it'll still be fun to use, it mainly depends on how server hosts decide to use it in their game

conc should be your baseline for how every other grenade is balanced. i like to think of grenades as the ace in the hole utility item that you use to turn the battle in your favor at very specific times. on the flipside, the cook mechanic acts as a telegraph for grenades so people know as soon as you plan to throw it that they need to relocate in order to stay alive. most people won't even get caught in a conc blast radius unless they're not paying attention or they're not aware of your presence at all. 88 is a lot for a flat radius damage, but its not the damage that matters in grenades, it's the pressure that it applies in battle.
well ok for conc this is fine but just
for the stick grenade i feel like it being able to instakill most players inside the blast radius is too much
should i lower its damage under 100 then?

3 seconds is my suggestion but its up to you, it all depends on how you want people to use the grenade in combat. i envision the slowdown as an open area denial that can be used best in wide crossings like roads or fields where enemies can be made easier targets for pop damage guns like snipers or shotguns.
alright 3 secs it is

u dont have to listen to phantos over everything cause his style of design is very specific

also i think normalizing the frag and the conc is a bad idea cause a lot of servers run obstruct radius damage to prevent explosive damage through walls/cover, which most people find bs

u dont have to listen to phantos over everything cause his style of design is very specific

also i think normalizing the frag and the conc is a bad idea cause a lot of servers run obstruct radius damage to prevent explosive damage through walls/cover, which most people find bs
yeah i know, i just like the ideas

also on second thought idk if i will change the frag and nail's behavior
i have obstruct radius damage too and it makes them kinda pointless because if there's no LOS there's no explosive damage either way

obstruct radius damage will kinda mess up the balance between conc and frag but yea its as conan said, i have a very specific design style and you can basically use any of the ideas at your own discretion

yes but i likey

also later i might make a generic gun pack idfk

also i'm making cluster grenade rn

nice model! are the mini grenades kept in the bottom part?