Better folder structure

Blockland Forums > Suggestions & Requests

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Richard Robertson:

--- Quote from: Ephialtes on January 06, 2010, 05:03:01 PM ---Because you're doing to have to define a "base path" for the config files to go in AppData and the add-ons and saves to go in the User folder or wherever. You're then going to have to go and find every reference to these file paths and add this "base path" to it. You're then going to have to go and modify how the Resource Manager works which is a nightmare to change anyway, so that the engine knows the files exist. You then have to hack up the existing security that prevents external folder access and allow it only access to the two base paths you defined.

Sounds like a mess to me.

--- End quote ---
Ok, riddle me this. Why weren't all these paths that need to be modified loaded from some central location? If all the strings are hard coded, that sounds like a nightmare in itself. Global_Paths_Addons, Global_Paths_InstalledFolder, etc would have been easier to manage from the beginning.

Also, would a project wide find-replace not work on all the paths? Since strings are double quoted, you wouldn't have to worry about accidentally replacing something that shouldn't have been modified.

As for your mention of the resource manager, are you telling me that the files are not loaded by string name?

You edited your post after I began replying. I've never written a game using a prebuilt engine. I've always written mine from scratch, the few that I've written. I don't write things as simple as a notepad. And Visual Basic sucks, I don't use it.

phflack:

--- Quote from: Richard Robertson on January 05, 2010, 10:46:51 PM ---I was saying that the entire addon folder should be relocated. Instead of "Blockland\Add-Ons" it would be "Documents\Add-Ons" or whatever.

--- End quote ---
i thought some things went into other folders?

Richard Robertson:

--- Quote from: phflack on January 06, 2010, 05:40:29 PM ---i thought some things went into other folders?

--- End quote ---
I'm not sure what you mean. All the addon zip files go in the one "Add-Ons" folder.

Trader:

--- Quote from: Richard Robertson on January 06, 2010, 03:24:26 PM ---It's not menial. It's the way programs are supposed to be written. It's called good practice. And I don't appreciate you putting programmer in quotes to say that I am not one.

Besides, changing paths is not hard. It would require changing ONE line of code for each path in a well structured program.

--- End quote ---

Alright, "programmer", what aren't you getting? Blockland runs on the Torque engine. The Torque engine demos do not require installation. The installer is simply something Badspot added for convenience for idiots who can't handle extracting files. You can test this yourself by opening the Blockland installer with an archive program like 7zip. I never use the installer at all. I just open the .exe with 7zip and extract the files inside to a location on my external drive.

Regarding your AppData / Application Data request, it's just stupid. Torque games are not set up to allow per-user mods. Look at pretty much any program that accepts plug-ins. Almost all of them have a plug-ins folder inside of the application's install folder. This is exactly how Blockland works. Add-Ons are plug-ins, and they go in the Add-Ons folder.

The problem here is not the design of the engine or the design of the game; the problem is with UAC. UAC's access control restrictions might actually be a good idea, but the "virtual store" is terrible. Telling a user that his files are in one location when you're actually abstracting the location of the files to some randomly generated folder is ridiculous.

Again, you have 2 options:

1. Disable UAC.
2. "Install" Blockland to another directory.

In my case, I do both. I disable UAC simply to get rid of the virtual store crap. Blockland runs from my external drive and I just make a shortcut to the .exe on the Desktop.

Richard Robertson:

--- Quote from: Trader on January 06, 2010, 06:00:46 PM ---Alright, "programmer", what aren't you getting? Blockland runs on the Torque engine. The Torque engine demos do not require installation. The installer is simply something Badspot added for convenience for idiots who can't handle extracting files. You can test this yourself by opening the Blockland installer with an archive program like 7zip. I never use the installer at all. I just open the .exe with 7zip and extract the files inside to a location on my external drive.

Regarding your AppData / Application Data request, it's just stupid. Torque games are not set up to allow per-user mods. Look at pretty much any program that accepts plug-ins. Almost all of them have a plug-ins folder inside of the application's install folder. This is exactly how Blockland works. Add-Ons are plug-ins, and they go in the Add-Ons folder.

The problem here is not the design of the engine or the design of the game; the problem is with UAC. UAC's access control restrictions might actually be a good idea, but the "virtual store" is terrible. Telling a user that his files are in one location when you're actually abstracting the location of the files to some randomly generated folder is ridiculous.

Again, you have 2 options:

1. Disable UAC.
2. "Install" Blockland to another directory.

In my case, I do both. I disable UAC simply to get rid of the virtual store crap. Blockland runs from my external drive and I just make a shortcut to the .exe on the Desktop.

--- End quote ---
The virtual store was created so that every program that tried to write to its program folder didn't require admin access. Also, the virtual store folder isn't randomly generated. "C:\Users\Richard\AppData\Local\VirtualStore\Program Files\Blockland" doesn't look random at all.

Have you got any experience with the Torque engine directly? I couldn't find any kind of source documentation on the website and I'm certainly not paying for the engine. I am wondering why it would be so hard to make it changeable.

And I have a question for all the UAC bashers who also happen to use any form of Unix/Linux. Do you complain about sudo?

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