[BLF Opinion dump] Are children, teenagers, young adults now too "soft?"

[ultimamax]

Transgenderism is also documented as a mental illness

nope, love dysphoria is documented as a mental illness. they're different

love dysphoria presents with DISTRESS about the disparity between your love and your gender

also even if you're going to make this semantic argument, it doesnt matter
the best treatment for being trans happens to be transitioning. nothing else works as good as transitioning
you calling it a "mental illness" literally only legitimizes it because it would mean that they cant help it

brb supporting transgenderism with loving e=mc^2
science is science is not an answer or an excuse

i literally explained how science (particularly, a HARD science, neuroscience and neuropsychology) supports transgenderism but OK

[Ad Bot]

[Red Spy]

name these biological reasonings

For thousands of years men (some women too maybe) were the ones out fighting lions while the
the best treatment for being trans happens to be transitioning. nothing else works as good as transitioning

the best treatment for being trans happens to be transitioning. nothing else works as good as transitioning

Then how come the Self Delete rate is the same before and after

Treatment and therapy would be an iota better but most people don't want to do that, so instead they have their genitals sliced up

[Path]

For thousands of years men (some women too maybe) were the ones out fighting lions while the women were raising children

And stuff similar to that.

Thousands of years later we aren't fighting lions anymore
Get with the times

[Tornado Kirby]

They're still all science, and there really isn't any conflict between the two. I fail to see your point.

That's not what he's saying. He's saying that both biology and psychology support this. Physics has nothing to do with it, it doesn't have an opinion.

saying that biology and psychology are the same because "science", and therefore are fit to counter/cross-reference/generally speak of in the same breath while trying to uphold in an argument, is like saying that american football and lacrosse are the same because "sports"
when they're two specific fields of science that, while they do share some similarities, are ultimately different enough that trying to use them both so closely is like trying to eat soup with a goddamned fork
it ain't gonna work, pal

[ultimamax]

saying that biology and psychology are the same because "science", and therefore are fit to counter/cross-reference/generally speak of in the same breath while trying to uphold in an argument, is like saying that american football and lacrosse are the same because "sports"
when they're two specific fields of science that, while they do share some similarities, are ultimately different enough that trying to use them both so closely is like trying to eat soup with a goddamned fork
it ain't gonna work, pal

hey dipstuff i specifically talked about how neuropsychology (which links biology and psychology) and neuroscience both support the conclusions made by psychology

his argument isnt relevant

[SeventhSandwich]

Well men are biologically (most men anyway) more masculine than women for a number of reasons

In terms of stature, bone structure, and the like, yeah.

Masculine behavior on the other hand is something that's mostly cultural. How men associate with certain colors, sports, mannerisms, roles, norms, etc is entirely the result of the random ways that societies develop. Not all of it is, and some traditionally male roles like hunting and fighting are probably influenced by hormones.

Regardless, lots of transgender people feel uncomfortable with their biological love as well, which is why plenty of them undergo hormone treatment and surgeries so that they physically express the masculinity/femininity that they feel inside.

[Tornado Kirby]

apples to oranges: the thread

[The Resonte!]

For thousands of years men (some women too maybe) were the ones out fighting lions while the [garbled]

that is a pretty interesting thing actually

Then how come the Self Delete rate is the same before and after

disapproval probably
it's still going to draw a lot of negative attention even afterwards by people who don't approve or those that hate it
like being disowned by family even after the treatment

Thousands of years later we aren't fighting lions anymore
Get with the times

you mean to say i can't fight lions?!?

[Path]

you mean to say i can't fight lions?!?

You can't fight lions because I said so. Go to your room.

Realistically speaking, humans have literally no loving need to hunt for food thanks to the enormous surplus that is available. Following the patterns of pretty much every civilization to ever exist, surplus wealth and quality of life leads to more opportunities to improve smaller aspects, such as gender identity and other stuff.

Honestly let them identify; it isn't hurting anyone.

[Red Spy]

disapproval probably

The only Self Delete rate similar in history is Jews under the national socialists

Are you saying trans people are treated the same way as the Jews were

[Ipquarx]

For thousands of years men (some women too maybe) were the ones out fighting lions while the women were raising children

And stuff similar to that.

Exactly, these are your standard hunter-gatherer stereotypes. The great thing about the modern world is that those stereotypes are useless here. We aren't hunter-gatherers anymore, both men and women fill both stereotypical roles now.

saying that biology and psychology are the same because "science", and therefore are fit to counter/cross-reference/generally speak of in the same breath while trying to uphold in an argument, is like saying that american football and lacrosse are the same because "sports"
when they're two specific fields of science that, while they do share some similarities, are ultimately different enough that trying to use them both so closely is like trying to eat soup with a goddamned fork
it ain't gonna work, pal

No, let me explain how science works.

Science works based on the scientific method. This is universal across all fields of science, including psychology, neuroscience and biology.
If you come up with a theory, like say "E=mc²" or "Transgendered people have something fundamentally in common with the opposite love of them that makes them feel the way they do," then you can design experiments, and when performed either help reinforce or disprove that theory. The more expanatory power your theory has and the more experiments that corroborate it, the greater chance that it's reality.

This is a universal method of figuring out what is and isn't true, it applies to all fields. And when two different fields of science all agree based on their experiments and observations that something is true, when either field alone could conclusively prove that it's real, it's doubly certain because the scientific method is what links them.

[Red Spy]

Exactly, these are your standard hunter-gatherer stereotypes. The great thing about the modern world is that those stereotypes are useless here. We aren't hunter-gatherers anymore, both men and women fill both stereotypical roles now.

The hunter gatherer era still have a biological impact today

[The Resonte!]

You can't fight lions because I said so. Go to your room.

YOU CAN'T TELL ME HOW TO LIVE MY LIIIIFFFEEEEEEE!!!!
[slams door]

The only Self Delete rate similar in history is Jews under the national socialists

Are you saying trans people are treated the same way as the Jews were

public norms are a nasty thing

source would be nice though i can't really say one or the other

The hunter gatherer era still have a biological impact today

define

[ultimamax]

Then how come the Self Delete rate is the same before and after

Treatment and therapy would be an iota better but most people don't want to do that, so instead they have their genitals sliced up

ive never actually heard that statistic sourced but
they're committing Self Delete because of the stuff they get from society at large. even after they transition. it has little to do with actually transitioning

The only Self Delete rate similar in history is Jews under the national socialists

Are you saying trans people are treated the same way as the Jews were

i think more jews would have committed Self Delete if they were actually capable of doing it
when you have literally no agency in like a concentration camp its actually hard to kill yourself
also you didnt source that either

[Path]

The hunter gatherer era still have a biological impact today

In poverish third-world countries, yes. However that's not what we're discussing at the moment.

If you're referring to the hormones that define the difference between male and female, then yes, it still exists because you can't entirely eliminate primal instinct. Boys like things that move, act, or are aggressive in nature as girls like things that can be nurtured and supported. However, much like the appendix, some of these hormonal instincts aren't necessarily applicable in a society where life and death isn't a daily occurrence.