Author Topic: Police Shoot and Kill an Unarmed Daniel Shaver (Read 15923 times)

Frankie� · December 08, 2017, 09:23:05 PM

Quote from: Planr on December 08, 2017, 06:45:40 PM

This video makes me wish all police officers were dead

a little bit...harsh...dont you think?

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Ceist · December 08, 2017, 09:25:51 PM

https://youtu.be/BvChaajJQrw (warning: more death)

I'd like to share this video, as the police officer in the video shot and killed a suicidal man, but was convicted of second-degree murder.

Both cops in each incident acted without reason or care, but unfortunately, only did one of these officers receive appropriate punishment.

These police officers in the Daniel Shaver incident were not properly trained or screened to perform their duties. All officers involved in the incident minus Brailsford should be penalized. Brailsford himself should be convicted of second-degree murder.

Also Planr is dumb. I hope you never end up in a situation fueled by adrenaline and fear, cuz you'll do some stupid ass stuff.

Frankie� · December 08, 2017, 09:27:14 PM

Quote from: Ceist on December 08, 2017, 09:25:51 PM

I hope you never end up in a situation fueled by adrenaline and fear, cuz you'll do some stupid ass stuff.

can confirm

Col. Burton · December 08, 2017, 09:27:58 PM

cop: "listen to my instructions, do not make a mistake, you are to keep your legs crossed"
cop: "push yourself up to a kneeling position"
>uncrosses legs while pushing himself up *mistake one*
>puts hands behind his back *mistake two*
cop: "if your hands go to the small of your back or down we will shoot you, do you understand me"
guy: "yes sir"
cop: "crawl towards me"
>begins to crawl, then reaches right hand to his waist *mistake three*

tbh he had three strikes, the cops commands weren't cryptic at all. The cop shot him because it looked like he was reaching towards a weapon in his wast band. I feel bad but put yourself in the cops shoes for a moment. Clearly there was an issue where they needed weapons drawn, and with the stress level with him already reaching towards the small of his back probably had them on high alert.

Ceist · December 08, 2017, 09:35:26 PM

Quote from: Col. Burton on December 08, 2017, 09:27:58 PM

cop: "listen to my instructions, do not make a mistake, you are to keep your legs crossed"
cop: "push yourself up to a kneeling position"
>uncrosses legs while pushing himself up *mistake one*
>puts hands behind his back *mistake two*
cop: "if your hands go to the small of your back or down we will shoot you, do you understand me"
guy: "yes sir"
cop: "crawl towards me"
>begins to crawl, then reaches right hand to his waist *mistake three*

tbh he had three strikes, the cops commands weren't cryptic at all. The cop shot him because it looked like he was reaching towards a weapon in his wast band. I feel bad but put yourself in the cops shoes for a moment. Clearly there was an issue where they needed weapons drawn, and with the stress level with him already reaching towards the small of his back probably had them on high alert.

Regardless of how many chances he had, there was no excuse for this. Brailsford went in there with the intent to shoot and not once did he think about anything else.

Col. Burton · December 08, 2017, 09:39:50 PM

Quote from: Ceist on December 08, 2017, 09:35:26 PM

Regardless of how many chances he had, there was no excuse for this. Brailsford went in there with the intent to shoot and not once did he think about anything else.

Quote from: Khaz on December 08, 2017, 02:20:56 PM

Shaver ... made a single hand motion, notably distant from his waist. Brailsford yelled at Shaver that if Shaver did anything whatsoever that deviated from his instructions he would shoot him and he probably wouldn�t survive. For unknown reasons Shaver then reached his right hand back towards his waistband again

I'm not defending the act of killing an unarmed man, but the commands were clear. perhaps since he was intoxicated he wasn't remembering the commands or something of the sort, but if an intoxicated man reaches towards his waistband not once, but twice (after he was told not to do it again or he "will not survive") that is end game.

Curse You · December 08, 2017, 09:41:11 PM

i just saw the full video and i still don't know why the charles (the obnoxious guy who kept yelling, philip did the shooting) kept telling him to do the most ridiculous stuff. like at one point he told him to put his left foot above his right foot, like what the forget lol

Kumquat · December 08, 2017, 09:45:57 PM

These are my police officers? These are the police who protect me in Mesa AZ? oh my god.

Ceist · December 08, 2017, 09:48:18 PM

Quote from: Col. Burton on December 08, 2017, 09:39:50 PM

I'm not defending the act of killing an unarmed man, but the commands were clear. perhaps since he was intoxicated he wasn't remembering the commands or something of the sort, but if an intoxicated man reaches towards his waistband not once, but twice (after he was told not to do it again or he "will not survive") that is end game.

Not an act of it, but you are defending the officer who performed it.

The commands given were ridiculously complicated. The video that ragequit posted earlier provided an excellent example of what is required of felonious police stops. Something of this nature could have been done to avoid death instead of something overly complicated with the threat of death every few seconds.

Prior examination of the area could have been done but they went in guns drawn without hesitation.

Quote from: Curse You on December 08, 2017, 09:41:11 PM

i just saw the full video and i still don't know why the charles (the obnoxious guy who kept yelling, philip did the shooting) kept telling him to do the most ridiculous stuff. like at one point he told him to put his left foot above his right foot, like what the forget lol

They do this to physically slow down the suspect so they can't react quickly, however the combination of commands thrown at Daniel Shaver were ridiculous.

Quote from: Kumquat on December 08, 2017, 09:45:57 PM

These are my police officers? These are the police who protect me in Mesa AZ? oh my god.

Honestly if I were in your shoes I'd petition to have Brailsford charged with murder.

Kumquat · December 08, 2017, 09:51:37 PM

Quote from: Ceist on December 08, 2017, 09:48:18 PM

Honestly if I were in your shoes I'd petition to have Brailsford charged with murder.

If the community college didnt just shut down for break I would have printed some stuff and put it around campus.

Im usually pro cop in these situations. This is clearly not one of those situations.

Ceist · December 08, 2017, 09:53:47 PM

Quote from: Kumquat on December 08, 2017, 09:51:37 PM

If the community college didnt just shut down for break I would have printed some stuff and put it around campus.

Im usually pro cop in these situations. This is clearly not one of those situations.

It depends on the situation, sometimes officers are jusitified, sometimes they're so fearful they react out of instinct, or they're blood thirsty, but rarely is the latter true.

Col. Burton · December 08, 2017, 09:54:52 PM

Quote from: Ceist on December 08, 2017, 09:48:18 PM

Not an act of it, but you are defending the officer who performed it.

I am not.

Quote from: Ceist on December 08, 2017, 09:48:18 PM

The commands given were ridiculously complicated.

They were simple, one thing at a time as they should be. The only complicated thing was "left foot over right foot", which was stupid but its still simple. If they were "ridiculously complicated" it would be: "crawl forward with your right hand first, looking to the left every time your right hand goes forward, and right whenever your left hand goes forward."

Kumquat · December 08, 2017, 09:58:59 PM

Quote from: Ceist on December 08, 2017, 09:53:47 PM

It depends on the situation, sometimes officers are jusitified, sometimes they're so fearful they react out of instinct, or they're blood thirsty, but rarely is the latter true.

As far as I know Mesa is timid. REALLY timid. I mean its just old people and Mormons. Its not like we are a central drug trade hub or anything.

No need to be all sgt call of duty

Planr · December 08, 2017, 10:04:29 PM

Quote from: Ceist on December 08, 2017, 09:35:26 PM

Regardless of how many chances he had, there was no excuse for this. Brailsford went in there with the intent to shoot and not once did he think about anything else.

Glad we can agree on this.

Ragequit · December 08, 2017, 10:12:16 PM

Quote from: Nonnel on December 08, 2017, 08:56:53 PM

I've been thinking about this and lemme just ask, can we at least agree there was negligence here? That this could've gone totally smoothly had the officer acted different? The man was completely disarmed and laying on the ground with his hands on his head. They 100% could have walked over and cuffed him, frisked him, whatever. Instead he kept yelling at him to crawl (wtf?) and warning him he was going to shoot and kill him if he didn't comply

yeah, i'll agree that this could have gone a lot better had they used a different tactic of having him come to them. that crawling stuff was dumb, but keep in mind they had to clear the room first.

Quote from: Nonnel on December 08, 2017, 08:56:53 PM

Even before that, the report they got was presumably "rifle spotted in a hotel room." why didn't they walk up to the door and ask "do you have a rifle in the room? what reason do you have to be keeping a rifle in your room? do you have a license? does the hotel know you're keeping this here?" Y'know, the kinda stuff you'd ask instead of yelling at the guy to shut up and "the time for diplomacy is over" while he's trying to explain.

you tell me what a rifle pointed out of the window of a hotel looks like 2 months after the deadliest mass shooting in american history, or even a rifle pointed out of a hotel window at all. you'd probably think something along the lines of "this guy's up to some bad stuff" right?