Author Topic: Leveling System Discussion  (Read 1637 times)

Probably everyone knows this, but now I'll post reasons why so on one has to ask.

1.Encourages less player interactions. Players will be to busy leveling up on monsters.

2. If you don't use monsters for leveling, I'll just boot up computer number 2 and start power leveling on Wedge Bot.

3. Creates an un-fair advantage from the start. Players right now can log on, buy a cheap sword, or crossbow, and start killing people from the start. Its all simple so you can do it from the start. No steep learning curve, if you have ever played an online FPS, then you can play AoT. Aim and fire. No rolling of the figurative 1d8 dice. No hit or miss depending on what you roll. Its all based on if your crosshair is lined up.

4. This is what makes AoT special. Its an FPS + RPG. It throws the crappy restraints of RPGs out the window. I can hook a window despite my low dexterity, or ride a horse just because I dumped all my skill points into cryptology. In a way, its more forgiving then the average RPG system.

5. It would take a long time to get this leveling system. Why a partial system? Then its not tested, it could have unforseen loopholes. Put in all the aspects of an entire leveling engine. Then you already know its been tested since the invetion of paper and irregularly sided dice.

6. Would require larger character files. Not much of a deal except on Badspots hard drive.

7. So what keeps me from leveling to level 100000? A cap? But then when I get to level 160 and I can beat everyone in the game, have every item, run a huge empire of merchants, assassins, and soldiers? Whats the point of playing anymore? With no leveling system, there are many new dimensions to combats. I'll sum them up here:

1. Who has the high ground?
2. Where are buildings positioned?
3. If there are multiple people, does the other team have the middle?
4. Is there a hill between us? Or a ditch?
5. Are we fighting across a body of water?
6. Is the other player mounted?

There is a lot more. But with a leveling system, it comes out to:

1. Am I 30 levels ahead of my oponent?

So what now? Do you suggest the adition of only players within a certain level can fight eachother? Well, what if I want to duel with my budy Greg, who happens to be 10 levels under me, to the death? Aparently I can't.

Then there is the case of no equal combat out in the ring anymore.

So I guess my bottom line is:
If you want more health, carry healing potions. Have your friends hold the ground for you. Always swing the battle in your favor, even if its an "unfair" tactic. 6v2 is fine in my opinion, the guys with 2 should have common sense to flee, not have such a high level that the other sides attacks are futile.
Do what Napolean did. Attack on holidays, while your enemy is AFK, where they least expect it.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2006, 09:51:34 AM by Wedge »


  • Administrator
Like it or not, there already is a "leveling" system, just not in the traditional sense.  A player with a magic crossbow has a huge advantage over someone with a rusty.  The hook is a huge advantage.  Having enough cash on hand for disposable horses and potions is another huge advantage.  There's a slight skill component to acquiring these things but theres a lot of treadmill work too.  It's already there and it cannot be avoided.

There is no way to have progression in the game and to have everything be completely skill based.  Unless of course you make a straight deathmatch game, which I dont want to do. 

1. I disagree.  In fact, I think it will result in more cooperation because players with different skills will have to work together to accomplish things.

2. I know the problems involved with pvp experience gain.  One solution is to have pvp encounters only result in exchange of exp.  So any exp you gain, the other player loses.  Or you can simply remove it completely.  People dont seem to need a numeric motivator to kill eachother.

3. I am highly opposed to the dice rolling that you describe.  It is one of my central complaints about other rpg systems and the impetus for AoT.  Leveling does not require dice rolling.

4. Again, leveling does not require the removal of FPS components nor the removal of basic functionality that is already established (hooking and horses)

5. Of course there are going to be loopholes.  That's part of the developement process.  I'm not just going to paste in D20 because 1: It sucks 2: I'd be sued. 

6. Not an issue.  Each character file right now is about 2k and we're talking about adding one line to each file. 

7. I dont understand this.  You dont want things to be added to the game because you'll finish them?  You ask whats the point of playing once you've maxed out your level- well wtf is the point of playing now?  Its an equivalent situation.  It's what's known as the "end game" in other MMOs

All your points stem from the assumption that I'm going to make the most idiot decisions possible.  Have a little more faith. 

I don't care how this turns out, AoT will still be great. It might not be in the sense it is now, but it will still be great.

Daaamn... Wedge got owned bad...

I was... Err... Checking to make sure he wouldn't make the same mistakes as other RPGs. Yeah.

i know how the lvl systym could work and be fair. heres how it works.
make killing people 5 levels below you fall under the "murder" crime.
make it also make players lose exp.
make you only do more damage to people as high level as you. i mean killing orcs in one hit and getting cash? come on.
i think if you use those three mechanics everything will work out fine.

Felix, you have a strong point. Like in Subspace, or Continuum as some call it, there is a penalty for killing weak players, and this is called negging. I believe it lowers your bounty rating or something like that. Killing orcs in one hit could be ok, you just don't get any gold. And losing experience in battle...hmm, well it would help restrain people from levelling up too quickly. I like these ideas very much.

I cant remember the name of it but there was this other rpg in production which had a clever levelling system that was skill based rather than playing-time based.

You start with 10 honour points (or something like that name). If you defeat an opponent in pvp, you get these two choices:

- kill them and get all their honour points (killing a level 10 would give you 10 honour points and bump you up to 20 honour points.). By killing a person they die and must start a new account/reset their current account and lose possesions.
- spare them. This gives you half their future honour points. for example, if they become a famous gladiator with 200 points you will take half of their points (100) and have 110 honour points! if they quit the game and never come back then you will only get 5 points. If the person got up to 200 honour points and lost them all to go back down to 50, you would lose honour points with them as you always have a share of what they do.

when sparing people they lose honour points as they share theirs with you.

If you have somebody sucking away your honour points then you can kill them to get them back.

 If somebody sucking your honours as they spared you doesnt play for atleast 1 hour a week they lose their share in you.

This has some flaws, but im sure you can squeeze them out.