Author Topic: White Privelege  (Read 5625 times)

i believe a person isnt defined by their race. but they will be treated differently because that race has a rep. a rep that was created by the majority of the people of that race at one time in history. i believe you can acknowledge that rep and not be tribal at the same time.

You really could've already stopped because you are making no point at all.
The point is that racism is idiotic because there is no difference between anyone and everyone who thinks race makes any difference as to how someone acts should be made fun of

You might be really dumb if you're not getting this

Okay but how does acknowledging a problem give people a way to solve it?
Are you so dense as to not listen to my point?

There is no proper solution. There are only stop-gap fixes. The best we can do is help a few people here and there.

but how does choosing not to acknowledge race issues help those who aren't as advantaged as you make a difference.
Thank you for trying to pin me down as the bad guy.

I never said "don't acknowledge issues exist". I said that there's no 100% accurate solution. At the end of the day, somebody is getting screwed over. I'm confident that I'm not going to be the one doing the screwing, but that's the most I can do without forcing people to follow my ideology to the letter, which I don't agree with.

i'm not sure if this problem should be looked at as framed around racism. racism is an unfortunate by-product of this cycle. it acts to perpetuate it in many ways, but i'm not really sure if you can say "white privilege is racism"

they will be treated differently because that race has a rep
^this is p much what i mean.



as for the problem of racism, it's definitely not an unsolvable issue. it has a lot of factors, but it's not natural. people are naturally weary of unfamiliarity, not races. people learn to be tribal. people also learn that race is really insignificant. it's not an easy thing to 'fix', and you certainly can't avoid people that are just jerkholes and hate people that are different from their goofy view of what a "normal human being" is, but it's not something that society as a whole will have to deal with being divided by throughout its existence.
« Last Edit: December 02, 2014, 12:10:33 AM by otto-san »

I was trying to tell you that your example applies to literally every characteristic of a person, not just race.
But race is one of the most prominent ways that people are judged in society.

I can't think of anything that is easier to become more prejudiced with than someone's race.
You can't tell someone's class or religion right off the bat in most cases.
The point is that racism is idiotic because there is no difference between anyone and everyone who thinks race makes any difference as to how someone acts should be made fun of
And nobody said race changed how people act, just how they are treated by others.

Which I've said numerous times?
Are you so dense as to not listen to my point?

There is no proper solution. There are only stop-gap fixes. The best we can do is help a few people here and there.
Thank you for trying to pin me down as the bad guy.

I never said "don't acknowledge issues exist". I said that there's no 100% accurate solution. At the end of the day, somebody is getting screwed over. I'm confident that I'm not going to be the one doing the screwing, but that's the most I can do without forcing people to follow my ideology to the letter, which I don't agree with.
But there are solutions to pretty obvious problems like profiling by police that could be expanded upon in order to find some common solution.
I'm not trying to make anyone seem like some bad guy but everyone is trying to explain stuff that literally everyone knows, thinking that they are some kind of messiah of a new age where racism could stop existing if everyone stopped being tribal (no brainer).

I never asked for an end-all-be-all for racism in general but applying some ideas to heavy situations in America would be at least a start.

And nobody said race changed how people act, just how they are treated by others.

Which I've said numerous times?
They're treated differently by others because they're focusing on race and not on how they act

Do you not know how racism works?

as for the problem of racism, it's definitely not an unsolvable issue.
Not without either killing individuals or removing free will, of which I'm a fan of neither.

it has a lot of factors, but it's not natural.
Did you miss the part where I mentioned pattern theory and stereotypes? People associate specific features of a race with people they don't trust and don't like, and so they continually treat all people with those features just the same. It's the brain trying to protect the person from a perceived threat.

It is completely natural. How do you think we learnt to avoid being eaten by lions and rhinos? It may seem like it's adapted itself in a very strange, mundane and stupid way, but this human defense mechanism still lives on and we cannot remove it with a snap of our fingers.

people are naturally weary of unfamiliarity, not races.
Thus demonstrating my point.

people learn to be tribal. people also learn that race is really insignificant.
The learning process is not an easy thing master, and there are some people whose brains are wired in a stubborn enough way to falsify facts and logic in order to prove itself "correct".

The brain will go with the path of least resistance, just the same as every force on Earth. Unfortunately, for most people, the path of least resistance is to be "ignorant" (aka, the boredom brain self defense mechanism).

If you want to solve racism, you first have to defeat boredom.

So one thing that's pretty cool that my friend introduced me to is the idea of AAVE, (African-American Vernacular English), which refers to the idea that what most (read: white) people would think of as "uneducated" slang is actually a dialect of English. ie "He don’t have no choice." This sentence is not legitimate in academic, standard English. However, the idea that people who would speak like that are uneducated or stupid is tribal. It's really a subconscious racism, since you hear someone who talks like that and you associate that with being black and poor and uneducated. In reality, that sentence works perfectly fine in the context of AAVE, which is just a different dialect of English. AAVE has grammar rules which are a combination of French, Spanish (?) and various African Languages. For example, the phrase "I don't think he married," omits the verb "to be", something that you cannot do in Standard English. However, AAVE has adopted grammar rules from other languages, in particular the idea that "to be" is implied in many sentences. As such, the "is" that would normally belong in that sentence does not need to be there, per the grammar of AAVE.

As such, we as a society have this idea that people who talk that way are stupid or that they are crude, which is rooted in a subconscious racism. This also accounts for when a black person is told, "You're the whitest black person I know!", which is essentially using white as a synonym for educated and well spoken, which is absurd. A black person who uses Standard English as opposed to AAVE will inevitably be seen as smarter and better educated, regardless of whether or not that is true. The way that this connects back to white privilege is that people who have grown up speaking AAVE will be required to learn an entirely new system of linguistics in order to get a job. This is predicated on the idea that people see AAVE as lesser to Standard English, just because it is unfamiliar. It's like if people in America had the impression that anyone speaking with a very roosterney accent was stupid. This suggests that because people speak in an unfamiliar way, they are worse than you. This is again related to racism, the idea that black people speak this way and therefor it is indicative of inferiority.

You said to mention your race and I'm like the whitest of whitey white people. Not to get all social justice up in here, but I've spent my entire life thinking (I mean, it is totally subconscious, but I recognize it now) that people who speak in AAVE are uneducated or stupid, that they are inherently different. So it was pretty striking when I learned that this is a real linguistic thing, that it's a legit dialect of the English language.

But there are solutions to pretty obvious problems like profiling by police that could be expanded upon in order to find some common solution.
Please explain how profiling is supposed to work in this situation.

but everyone is trying to explain stuff that literally everyone knows, thinking that they are some kind of messiah of a new age where racism could stop existing if everyone stopped being tribal (no brainer).
And so you have to rain down on people telling them off because they simply wanted to make a 20 second comment on the Internet?

This isn't some essay writing class where we're handing in our final thesis on social justice. It's a loving Internet forum, mostly filled with young kids still getting their heads around how the world works.

This isn't some essay writing class where we're handing in our final thesis on social justice.
forget

They're treated differently by others because they're focusing on race and not on how they act
No stuff? Is that not exactly what I've stated?
And nobody said race changed how people act, just how they are treated by others.
What do you think I'm trying to communicate to you exactly?

You can't get rid of people who are tribal, you reform a system in which their ideas do not have enough power to be influential to society, economics, and government.

We live in a system where the majority race gets the most benefits. That's where the change should be centered.
You can't just choose not to acknowledge race when there are still advantages and disadvantages held by the majority. Get everyone on an equal ground and then everyone can be as colorblind as they please.

That's basically my entire point watered down to be pretty much idiot-proof.

EDIT: if you have any disagreements with what was previously stated could you just stop typing at this point because I've just went full circle with my entire argument
Please explain how profiling is supposed to work in this situation.
Well for once you could introduce programs which sensitize law officials to black and latino minorities. The ones that are mostly persecuted for reasons that a white person wouldn't be.
And so you have to rain down on people telling them off because they simply wanted to make a 20 second comment on the Internet?

This isn't some essay writing class where we're handing in our final thesis on social justice. It's a loving Internet forum, mostly filled with young kids still getting their heads around how the world works.
I "told you off" because you put your logic in so little detail that it could literally be interpreted as an entirely different and much more ignorant viewpoint altogether.
« Last Edit: December 02, 2014, 12:28:40 AM by Aces »


It may just be where I live, but I can't help being tribal.  I live very close to the Mexican/American border in California, and I actually makes me angry seeing these people come and take up tons of jobs, making it almost impossible for high schoolers like me who are actual citizens to get a basic job. I sound like a stereotyping starfish when I say this, but most crime in the area is committed by mexicans also. I've had my wallet, skateboard, and jackets all stolen on different occasions, and when the criminals were caught each one of them was mexican. Even one of them went to my school.

Most of the people I know are this way too. They don't trust them at all. Now I'm not saying all mexicans are bad, it just seems like the ones in America and just south of the border. If you cross the border, yeah, it's a decent chance you'll get robbed,  raped, or killed. I've been to deep Mexico though, and the mexicans there are great, honest, people. Can some explain this phenomenon?  

I'd guess that the people who illegally crossed out of Mexico are more likely to be criminals than people who actually live in their home country.
I can type i swear
« Last Edit: December 02, 2014, 01:19:00 AM by Dreams_Of_Cheese »

We live in a system where the majority race gets the most benefits. That's where the change should be centered.
You can't just choose not to acknowledge race when there are still advantages and disadvantages held by the majority. Get everyone on an equal ground and then everyone can be as colorblind as they please.
By "you're an idiot if you acknowledge race," you should be taking that as my stance of "the government shouldn't acknowledge race in law"
idiots can be idiots but as long as the government isn't trying to get involved with how far the extent of their idiocy can go, that's just dandy.