Why is All Lives Matter considered tribal?

[otto-san]

it's just often dismissive and used to deflect the problems BLM is protesting back onto black people. instead of acknowledging the problems that the movement brings up, it refuses to look at it deeper than its name, then dismisses the movement as a whole for being inherently tribal, which is a very convenient reversal for a movement that has its roots in individuals claiming to be the victim of institutional racism. it's low-effort rhetoric that people use to indirectly blame black people for their problems, or at the very least, divert attention from those problems with an accusation of racism

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[Tactical Nuke]

This statistic is about the actual numbers of people that are shot - this shouldn't be a surprise because white people are 63% of the US population and black people are only 12%.
Source

Please take your bullstuff narrative somewhere else.

If we're talking bullstuff narratives, the one you just pulled up is a fresh, hot, steaming pile of donkey turds.

https://law.yale.edu/system/files/area/workshop/leo/leo16_fryer.pdf

This paper explores racial differences in police use of force. On non-lethal uses of force, blacks and Hispanics are more than fifty percent more likely to experience some form of force in interactions with police. Adding controls that account for important context and civilian behavior reduces, but cannot fully explain, these disparities. On the most extreme use of force – officer-involved shootings – we find no racial differences in either the raw data or when contextual factors are taken into account. We argue that the patterns in the data are consistent with a model in which police officers are utility maximizers, a fraction of which have a preference for discrimination, who incur relatively high expected costs of officer-involved shootings.

Black people commit over 50% of all homicides. White people commit 45% of them. That means that relatively, black people kill people about 7-10 times the rate that white people do. When black people kill, such as whites do, victims tend to be overwhelmingly members of the perpetrator's race. 93% of black-perpetrated homicides are against other blacks, and in 2015, about 6,000 blacks were killed by other blacks, as opposed to 258 killed by police, and that's not even to consider the justification for each shooting by police. These statistics have even been consistent for decades.

Hostilities towards police can basically be explained by the breakdown of the African-American family and the increased aggressiveness towards the police brought on by rappers constantly yelling "forget the police" and other variations. If you don't have a father in the house, you are waaay more likely to become a criminal. This is proven fact. Even Obama commented on it. Considering the hellhole that the ghetto is and how the left just pulled the cops out of those neighborhoods (not literally of course), no stuff you're going to get tenser relations with cops.

[otto-san]

Hostilities towards police can basically be explained by the breakdown of the African-American family and the increased aggressiveness towards the police brought on by rappers constantly yelling "forget the police" and other variations. If you don't have a father in the house, you are waaay more likely to become a criminal.

i think poverty has a much more intimate link with crime than family influences, and i think poverty is also probably heavily involved in these family problems

[King Tøny]

it's a hollow feel-good message that seeks to purposely belittle any racial movements because "The blacks think it's all about them",

Well it's true, right? After all the group is named "Black Lives Matter" not "Black Lives Also Matter" or "Black Lives Matter, too"

So black lives are more important than Native American lives?

Hispanic?

Asian?

Maybe they should change their group name.

[Insert Name Here²]

Imo saying "all lives matter" is much better than just saying one racial group matters more than the others.

[SeventhSandwich]

Black people commit over 50% of all homicides. White people commit 45% of them. That means that relatively, black people kill people about 7-10 times the rate that white people do. When black people kill, such as whites do, victims tend to be overwhelmingly members of the perpetrator's race. 93% of black-perpetrated homicides are against other blacks, and in 2015, about 6,000 blacks were killed by other blacks, as opposed to 258 killed by police, and that's not even to consider the justification for each shooting by police. These statistics have even been consistent for decades.

BLM doesn't protest every single time a black man is killed - just when an unarmed one is killed, under suspicious circumstances, and coincidentally the cop gets off with zero consequences.

also, what are BLM's efforts, anyway? all I see them doing is making it easier to vilify cops and driving them away from their neighborhoods, which in turn raises the amount of crime that happens, which escalates the even bigger issue of lethal black-on-black crime

They more-or-less embody the social push towards body cameras, deescalation techniques, and better cop-community relations. Before people started protesting, larger society as a whole was either unaware or didn't give a stuff about any of this.

Imo saying "all lives matter" is much better than just saying one racial group matters more than the others.

Hence why the movement is called "Black Lives Matter More Than Whites". Just like that pesky "Breast-Cancer-The-Only-Important-Disease Awareness Month".

[Tactical Nuke]

Ask yourself whether the clips and stories you hear are a representative sample, or whether the people showing you those clips and stories have carefully curated them in order to make you think a certain thing. This applies to your links as well, Tactical Nuke.

I consider it a representative sample when it's the leaders of the organization. You didn't have MLK and all his buddies calling for white peoples' heads, did you?

I never "pulled up" any kind of narrative - I just pointed out your bullstuff understanding of statistics.

Here's a quote from the conclusion of that paper:
Maybe the stark racial disparity in all uses of force but lethal are the reason for tension between the police and minorities? I don't have time to hyperbrown townyze this paper so I'm not going to treat it as gospel, but it presents a more nuanced reality than the one you're proposing.

You're changing your argument and then pretending it was always that way. I answered your claim that blacks were 2.5 times more likely to get shot than white people, which the paper disproves. In that regard, police use of non-lethal force in regards to different races is irrelevant.

Tension between minorities and police results from the statistics that I listed. You can't deny that if you were a cop and you were in a situation where you were confronting an Asian, whose race was responsible for 62% of all homicides (hypothetical scenario), that you would treat him differently than a black man, who were responsible for 10%. Interactions can go south really loving fast. One black leader took part in exercises simulating this and was genuinely surprised at what he did in each scenario.

As for your ideas about rap/absent fathers I'd love to see actual sociological research instead of your stuffty backseat speculation

The absence of fathers leading to crime is a well-known fact. Here's a video that basically summarizes it, with a little more context on how the African-American family got to be so divided. A majority of black leaders acknowledge that it's a significant problem, sometimes even more than "racism".

[Master Matthew²]

yursa is a handicap and should be kicked out of BLM. her words don't reflect BLM's message

No true Scotsman fallacy

[SeventhSandwich]

I consider it a representative sample when it's the leaders of the organization. You didn't have MLK and all his buddies calling for white peoples' heads, did you?

MLK was head of a non-governmental organization with directors, a 501 c. 3, and concrete principles. BLM is a decentralized movement a-la Anonymous that does not have leaders. Whoever people consider the 'leaders' of BLM is usually just whoever is speaking the loudest, which tends to be people on the disproportionately-crazy extreme of their ideological spectrum. Ironically their voices are spread by the same people who think they're idiots, which is why people look at Matthew's video of that Twitter post and think, "wow, she must be the leader of BLM because they're both on television right now."

Shaun King is actually a very reasonable man who has a lot of meaningful things to write about. You've discredited him because he's super light-skinned, but honestly he's one of the best faces of BLM.

[Nonnel]

No true Scotsman fallacy

fallacy fallacy since you didn't elaborate, cuck

[ultimamax]

You're changing your argument and then pretending it was always that way. I answered your claim that blacks were 2.5 times more likely to get shot than white people, which the paper disproves. In that regard, police use of non-lethal force in regards to different races is irrelevant.

The paper didn't "disprove" stuff you loving moron, it just provided an explanation. I did not make a false "claim" by quoting that FACT. You were misinterpreting a statistic fundamentally and I provided a correct interpretation (even if that interpretation had a different explanation)

The absence of fathers leading to crime is a well-known fact. Here's a video that basically summarizes it, with a little more context on how the African-American family got to be so divided. A majority of black leaders acknowledge that it's a significant problem, sometimes even more than "racism".

>PragerU
lol

[Verification]

the simple answer: it's like kicking someone's dog and then saying "oh my god all other kicked dogs matter"
it's true but it would rub it in a bit more, it's just rude

[Master Matthew²]

the simple answer: it's like kicking someone's dog and then saying "oh my god all other kicked dogs matter"
it's true but it would rub it in a bit more, it's just rude

Yeah, but if the other kicked dogs are neglected in favour of that one particular dog...

[Verification]

Yeah, but if the other kicked dogs are neglected in favour of that one particular dog...

They are not neglected, they just get less attention from the media because they've been kicked more instead of this other dog.

[Tactical Nuke]

The paper didn't "disprove" stuff you loving moron, it just provided an explanation. I did not make a false "claim" by quoting that FACT. You were misinterpreting a statistic fundamentally and I provided a correct interpretation (even if that interpretation had a different explanation)

fair enough

>PragerU
lol

do you want to watch the video or are you going to keep grandstanding