Before releasing your map/add-on...

[Irk89]

This started out as a reply to Space Guy's "Team Deathmatch v4.1a" and I decided that it was a big enough rant to start its own topic.

I'm going to post my opinion as my opinion and as a suggestion.  The fact that you have numbers AND letters in your release title (4.1a) scares me away from ever downloading this add-on.  Don't get me wrong I'm sure it's a great add-on and very functionable but the fact that your on a version and not just a version but 4.1a must mean that you released a "product" before it was ready, which also might mean that this version has been released before it was ready.

All I'm trying to say is produce the concepts for your add-on, develop those concepts, debug, and polish.  It's a combination of the appearance of stability and actually being stable.  Granted this add-on is a fairly large add-on, you still should be able to release it with little or no updates to the stability of the code.

Reinventing your add-on such as your jumps from v1 to v2 to v4 is different since you're completely revamping the add-on and adding more to it.  I'd also like to extend this rant out to mapping.  I don't want to be in your beta map, so don't release it until it's nicely polished.

I don't know if I'm the only one that feels this way.  Most of you I'm sure just want your product as soon as possible.  I'd also like to say as a disclaimer that this doesn't always stand true because some times it's just not possible to debug and polish without releasing to the general public, however this is blockland.  You should be able to release a full add-on without having to update it every week.

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[rkynick]

You'd like it to work that way, but the thing is, you might find bugs later that you didnt find earlier, whats so wrong with that?
Imagine a new mod comes out and it lets a bug you didnt find earlier surface in your mod(i.e lets people do something you didnt account for), then you would have to fix it, right?

Or maybe something will just show up, either way, you have to deal with it.

[Irk89]

I'm not saying don't go back and fix your bugs. I'm saying spend more time in the development of your add-on, especially in the debug and polishing phases of your development.  Then you won't have to go back as much or at all to fix these things.

[Space Guy]

I generally release a new 'whole' version of the mod if I change a lot of features in it, such as redoing the whole mod (TDM) or redoing large sections of code, such as the Portal Gun.
In version 4.1, I added a few new features, such as a "default minigame", but I didn't exactly redo everything.
In version 4.1a, I had only just discovered a few minor bugs, and only changed existing code and features to fix this.

In all of the versions, the mod was tested and stable. The bugs would usually only cause a problem if you knew what they were and deliberately caused them, such as the "Wrench Events Limit" problem. I did not release an Add-On with syntax errors and large flaws, it did not crash the game if you ran a server with it three times, etc.

[Aloshi]

I agree with RkyNick and Space Guy. Especially for amateurish coders and modelers, they may learn new information on how to improve or add to an Add-On. This has been the case with me many times, and much of the time, it's when someone gives me an idea (I am not that creative). And sometimes, you can't run a beta in your server very well without idiots running around that you have to deal with, spamming up the chat while someone is trying to report a bug to you (because of this, I have started doing private betas on a passworded server, but sometimes you can't round up a tester or three).

[Jervan]

Im spending a stupendous amount of time on the Magic Server, yet no doubt someone will find an exploit. You just cant stop it unless its a really basic mod.

[Irk89]

Ok, well I guess I'm really on my own on this one.  The real point I wanted to put across is when I'm browsing through the add-ons, I really just want a full, final, and professional add-on to download and then never have to worry about again instead of downloading it, and then having to update it once a week.

Maybe we should set up an advanced blockland testing site in which developers can come and post beta material and impatient users and other developers can help test this material.  Throwing out ideas.

[Jervan]

Maybe just a "finished" Add-On section that you can't post topics in, it just has to be moved by Badspot into the section...

[rkynick]

Jervan, that would = more work for badspot which would = distractions from getting v9 out already

[Aloshi]

You won't have to worry about this when RTB 2.0 comes out, since I believe it auto-updates mods for you.

[Irk89]

You won't have to worry about this when RTB 2.0 comes out, since I believe it auto-updates mods for you.

Well that's good news, however I hope developers don't decide to release early just because they can update it later.

[laremere]

I agree and disagree at the same time irk.  There are many mods that are above a simple concept and are therefor prone to bugs, that often times can only be found with puplic use.  But, I am tired of reading add-on makers saying "Redownload, I fixed the echo/missing file/bad handling.

[Trader]

While I agree with the ideal you're promoting Irk, it doesn't always work in real life.

Here's an example:

I put a great deal of effort into my Portals Add-On.  It was well-tested, well-organized, and relatively bug-free.  However, one major issue that didn't come up during testing was Portal performance with large numbers of bricks.  The original code searched through the bricks in the server every time you used a Selector Portal.  I had to rework it so that Portals are added to a list when they are created and removed from the list when they are destroyed.  This made Portals infinitely more efficient, and I extended this concept to Doors and Elevators code as well.

Now, something that should satisfy our need for polished Add-Ons, yet still make obtaining much-needed updates as easy as possible is RTB2.  RTB's download system will be able to notify you of updates when they become available, download those updates, and enable their content...without restarting Blockland.  Also, it will let you specify which Add-Ons are required for yours to operate.  IE, Mod JVS Core will be required for Doors, Elevators, and Portals and Space Guy's SpaceTick, etc. will be required for TDM and Portals.

Hopefully, this can become a great solution to this very important issue.

[laremere]

Yes.  I really am looking forward to the new add-on system and RTB2 more then wrench events.

[Jervan]

Im planning to use the PPT Library on RTB2 too :)

This pretty much solves everything including this topic :D