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Author Topic: Overwatch Megathread  (Read 898885 times)

soldier in tf2 was slow as forget but if you understood the game mechanics you could outrun a scout
in this game everybody is slow and no matter how good you are nothing will change that (except lucio)

go to the quoted post for context of everything i didnt feel like pasting his quote into another quote

having the classes move slow purposefully is not the only solution to this problem

   most of the maps usually are one straight path and a few alternative paths that usually cut off from the main path to rejoin it later to allow flanking. on some maps there are choke points where the main path becomes the only route. this is very linear but linearity is also not inherently bad and is probably required in order for the rest of the mechanics to function well.

   tracer has the most boring gun in the game and her abilities arent much better. blink is just a general movement tool that lets the player zip around the map and get out of harms way. the distance of blink is large enough that one blink anywhere is usually enough to escape whatever is coming at you and the 3 blink reservoir ensures that anyone who doesnt blink like some kind of dumb ass can get away. as blink is a movement tool it can also be used for chasing and outflanking but due to the slow movement speed tracer has a flowchart of: blink to gain the positional advantage > hopefully kill someone > blink away or press e because blink and e are the only way to get in and out of places quickly. her other e ability whatever its called serves as a get out of damage free card and maybe a forth blink if anyone ever finds the need to dive 3 blinks in. tracers weapons dont really help anything if we are talking skill level as they are point and click raycast automatics that anyone braindead can use.

   genji is similar to tracer but more difficult to play in that he does movement stuff a lot except his dash has a bigger cooldown and is more situational because you cant store it, his ranged weapons are semiautomatic slower projectiles, and he has to rely more on his unique wall climbing and double jumping shenanigans to find flanking positions and avoid the big dudes on the front. his only real difficulty thing over tracer is his weapon being harder to hit as he has a bunch of other movement gimmicks and the fastest movespeed in the game to make up for any difficulty with positioning and escaping. you seem to have exclusively picked the movement based glass cannons perhaps assuming that speed = hard to play but i would definitely rank someone like junkrat or lucio or anyone who requires good aim or a lot more situational awareness as up there too. really though the difference between how the skill floor of classes is miniscule while the skill ceiling, while having more variation, is still not much.

   i said movement speed was less important than positioning here and you appear to have misinterpreted it. what i mean to say was "and, because of the movement speed, positional advantage is key instead of dodging" so im actually agreeing with you here. team comp also matters but certainly not as much as you are making it out to be and in my experience generally a team can get along just fine as long as there is a tank and a healer, especially in pub games which is what 99% of the people playing this will probably only play, including me and you most likely. im assuming you are talking about skill being like the basics of playing games and yes i agree that skill definitely matters in like every game and that a team that is more skill will defeat a team that is less skilled. the problem i have with overwatch is that the slow movement and general lack of options for each hero diminishes the skill ceiling of the individual which in turn forces people to work together in order to beat the other guys, making the game team based. this formula is undoubtedly a direct and intentional rip from dota and its ilk; those games do the exact same stuff

   as for the subjectivity of difficulty as a result of online, yeah you will undoubtedly be stuff on by someone far better than you but my problem with overwatch is that it forbids this kind of stuffting unless its done in a group and yeah playing things together with friends is always fun but a group of friends can play anything and have fun. that one dude whose name i forgot mentioned that tf2 was more individually focused and it is inadvertently because it allows the individual to exert his skills far better with classes like the scout and the soldier but also rewards group play with stuff like the medic and engineer. tf2 is a pretty bad example of this maybe tribes would be better but oh well forget i wrote all of this bullstuff nobody will read anyway.
Holy stuff that's a lot.

Some of the maps are forced to be fairly linear because of the game mode, such as payload. They deal with this by having many different paths, and adding more dimensions to the map then just ground level i.e rooftops that can't be accessed by some heroes and fully enter-able buildings. KoTH isn't linear at all and more arena-ish, and control point is argueably linear but not really, it kind of feels more like KoTH because of the point focus.

On Tracer, I think her weapons are fine. The main reason you might think her weapons are boring is probably because they really don't do a lot of damage. This is where I see the skill come in, similar to Genji. It's not a game of total accuracy with tracer, but more of knowing when to get in and get out, and understanding who you can safely pester/kill or who to forget off from. A good tracer isn't an objective player, but more a behind the scenes 1v1 fighter or group annoyance.

Forcing people to work together is neither a "rip from games like DotA" or bad. I really don't need to say much more than that but I will anyway. As you said, this game is team-based, and because of that, requires team cooperation. There are heroes that don't need to worry too much about being around and pushing with others, but in the end they all work towards the same goal of either getting a payload to the end or capping a point. Games that require teamwork like this are not specifically related to DotA and MOBAS in general, they are everywhere. For example in CS:GO if you don't have teamwork you don't have stuff, at least in the upper brackets of the game.

This isn't a point of its own, but you keep saying that heroes have limited options, when that's straight up not true. For one, while there isn't a vast amount of abilities for each hero, typically the actual amount of uses for the abilities that a hero does have is limitless or at least feels like it. If you play with the same mindset of "I'm only going to use my mine for rocket jumping" or "I'm only going to use my grapple hook to get up on a ledge" then it's you who is limiting your options, not the game.
EDIT: Seeing as you are keen on relating this game to DotA, you can compare the two in this aspect.

soldier in tf2 was slow as forget but if you understood the game mechanics you could outrun a scout
in this game everybody is slow and no matter how good you are nothing will change that (except lucio)
Actually, if you understand half the heroes you can get away from most situations. There are a few that can't get away and this is no doubt intentional, and only means you have to understand when not to overextend (Which a lot of people don't).
« Last Edit: May 05, 2016, 10:03:11 PM by Nymph »

so hey guys how about that 6 man team

so hey guys how about that 6 man team
Me and my friends like to play in groups so you can join us sometime, unless you mean like an actual dedicated team.

Actually, if you understand half the heroes you can get away from most situations. There are a few that can't get away and this is no doubt intentional, and only means you have to understand when not to overextend (Which a lot of people don't).
inaba wants to get to mid at a reasonable speed
inaba cannot rocket jump
inaba cannot sticky jump
inaba wants to go fast
inaab doesn't want to play scout

bastion is really easy to kill

it's just his team that is the problem
this
a solo bastion is pretty easy to pick off, but if he has atleast a semi-competent team around him, its almost impossible to do anything  without spamming ults at him cause the second you get into his sightlines, you're dead instantly and you cant overwhelm him cause your team is being held off by the extra people

even if I do something like blink behind his entire team as tracer and start shooting him from behind, he just turns around and guns me down in a second unless I have my ult.

bastion used to have a shield but could only shoot in a certain cone
so be appreciative that he doesn't have a shield anymore
even if I do something like blink behind his entire team as tracer and start shooting him from behind, he just turns around and guns me down in a second unless I have my ult.
tracer isnt a solo hero try soldier 76

try soldier 76
Or Mei, Mei is the best a 1v1s...
inaba wants to get to mid at a reasonable speed
inaba cannot rocket jump
inaba cannot sticky jump
inaba wants to go fast
inaab doesn't want to play scout
I might be stupid for asking this, but who is inaba?

tracer isnt a solo hero try soldier 76
man that's an odd way to spell McCree

man that's an odd way to spell McCree
for a solo hero soldier 76 has a stuffton of utility
healing + high dps + rockets as finishers + sprint is just great

for a solo hero soldier 76 has a stuffton of utility
healing + high dps + rockets as finishers + sprint is just great
yea but he's not a cowboy



Mei is kickass.
mei is a little stuff
reinhardt is as slow as a penguin and mcree only has his action roll so by law i have to exert extreme dislike towards mei
how am i supposed to clobber the snot out of an asian with my hammer if i can't catch up to the asian

how am i supposed to clobber the snot out of an asian with my hammer if i can't catch up to the asian
well with mccree u just flash bang headshot her