POLITICS & DONALD Annoying Orange MEGATHREAD

[otto-san]

Honestly, I think Filibustering should be punishable, almost always the reason nothing gets loving done.

Filibustering is done intentionally to shut down bills and heed progress in any direction.

the senate has loose debate rules by design; it's meant to be slow and deliberate. the filibuster is a tool that minorities in the senate can use to slow down the political process and seek representation. just because you're represented as the ideological majority right now doesn't mean it isn't still an important political tool. i'm sure come midterms when the dems almost certainly take the senate again, you'll be grateful that the filibuster is still around.

nothing gets done because nobody in congress can agree on anything remotely controversial due to the continuing trend of ideological drift; the filibuster is a tool, not the problem.

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[Master Matthew²]

Solar power has caught up very quickly with coal and oil in terms of cost efficiency. Dependence on fossil fuels will only last until 2060 at most. The effects of climate change is already causing havoc as we speak. Short term economic stability is hardly an upside compared to the numerous reasons we have to switch. We should have made the effort to do so years ago, and an EPA head who doesn't believe in environmental protection is the last thing we need right now.

There is no debate.

Then we don't need a massive EPA anymore, we need a Government Sponsored Solar Panel-Based Power System switch.
And I don't see why it's always an "all or nothing" situation with this argument, this is not something that can be swapped overnight.
If the Government Sponsors a switch from Fossil fuels to Solar Panels, we get Two things out of it:
1. A Fuel Source that isn't dependent on Digging up liquid stuff.
2. More Jobs for those obtaining the resources to get the materials to make solar panels.

YES the environment is important, But in no way did I ever say we should stay with OIL or anything like that, I only said we have an issue when it comes to pointless regulations, some of which are way out of date.

Yes the EPA head isn't exactly all there when it comes to scientific understanding, But again this isn't an ALL IN situation.

We don't need to pull ALL our resources to stop this stuff IMMEDIATELY, there needs to be a switch, but it sure as hell can't happen in a day.
YES, push for this movement, YES make essays and stuff to send to your congressmen, YES this is certainly true.

But you need to word these things coming from an economic point of view, not a liberal based open heart and mind point of view.

Gather the numbers, gather the information, prove that Solar Energy is more profitable than Fossil Fuels.

This is certainly not an easy situation, but it can be solved.

[Master Matthew²]

the senate has loose debate rules by design; it's meant to be slow and deliberate. the filibuster is a tool that minorities in the senate can use to slow down the political process and seek representation. just because you're represented as the ideological majority right now doesn't mean it isn't still an important political tool. i'm sure come midterms when the dems almost certainly take the senate again, you'll be grateful that the filibuster is still around.

nothing gets done because nobody in congress can agree on anything remotely controversial due to the continuing trend of ideological drift; the filibuster is a tool, not the problem.

Now while I still believe the filibuster is a problem, that doesn't mean it isn't a useful tool, but it's so uncontrolled and unaccounted for it's usage, there needs to be more restrictions and markings.

Examples:
Bills that have been skipped as a result of a filibuster must be marked as such, even if they are combined with another law in the future, or if they are separated into parts later.
Bills that have been marked as 'filibustered' Bills, even if they are within another bill, must be announced the instant the bill is put on the table.

[otto-san]

so you basically agree the federal government should fund renewable energy sources (which the EPA is doing), but what kind of pointless regulations are you talking about? i think it's pretty important that businesses don't dump massive amounts of pollutants like CO2 and mercury into the air, water, and land, and those are the sorts of things that are being targeted here

Now while I still believe the filibuster is a problem, that doesn't mean it isn't a useful tool, but it's so uncontrolled and unaccounted for it's usage, there needs to be more restrictions and markings.

Examples:
Bills that have been skipped as a result of a filibuster must be marked as such, even if they are combined with another law in the future, or if they are separated into parts later.
Bills that have been marked as 'filibustered' Bills, even if they are within another bill, must be announced the instant the bill is put on the table.

the filibuster is just a result of the senate's lack of restrictions on floor time. a standing filibuster ends when people either stop talking or the senate votes for cloture, which requires a 2/3 supermajority vote. most legislative actions that aren't controversial can be effectively killed by simply stating an intention to filibuster, but a filibuster doesn't kill a bill, it just exhausts people until they don't care enough to vote yes any more. there's no way of knowing whether a bill died because it was filibustered or if people just were convinced not to vote on it, because the bill still gets a vote. also, the democrats restricted the filibuster for certain presidential nominations back in 2013, much to the well-justified dismay of republicans, who were very quick to accurately state that this is a move they would later regret. the republicans were eyeing similar moves to gut the filibuster for cabinet nominations recently. people are only having problems with the filibuster now because of how much use it's been seeing in recent contentious climates, but heavily impeding its use is something that's only going to result in lesser representation for everyone down the line.

[Kingdaro]

And I don't see why it's always an "all or nothing" situation with this argument, this is not something that can be swapped overnight.

Of course not.

YES the environment is important, But in no way did I ever say we should stay with OIL or anything like that, I only said we have an issue when it comes to pointless regulations, some of which are way out of date.

What regulation? Carbon taxes? River dumping regulations? I had the impression those were a good thing.

We don't need to pull ALL our resources to stop this stuff IMMEDIATELY, there needs to be a switch, but it sure as hell can't happen in a day.
YES, push for this movement, YES make essays and stuff to send to your congressmen, YES this is certainly true.

Absolutely.

But you need to word these things coming from an economic point of view, not a liberal based open heart and mind point of view.

Gather the numbers, gather the information, prove that Solar Energy is more profitable than Fossil Fuels.

I just did that. There's tons of data on this. Solar is (for now) more expensive in the short term, but Fossil Fuels are far more of a liability in the long term.

[beachbum111111]

Solar energy is stuff. Nuclear is the only real alternative.

[Kingdaro]

Oh hey, look at that. An affordable commercial solar battery. Neat.

[beachbum111111]

And how long would it be charged for in -40 weather?

[Kingdaro]

And how long would it be charged for in -40 weather?

Long enough?

When your solar panels produce more electricity than you can use in your home, the excess is stored in the battery pack instead of being sent back into the electric grid. Later, when your panels aren’t producing enough electricity, you can use the electricity stored in your Powerwall instead of having to buy it from your utility.

Normally, this process happens over the course of a day: when the sun is high in the sky and your solar panels are producing more electricity than you can use, the surplus energy is stored in your Tesla Powerwall. As the sun goes down and your solar panel production decreases, you draw on the electricity that you stored during the sunniest part of the day. Essentially, the Powerwall helps you balance out your electricity production and usage over the course of the day.

Cloud cover isn't dependent on temperature, by the way.

Like. It's the loving sun. It's like. Always there. Harnessing it's practically boundless energy doesn't leave us with deathly cancerous radioactive material that's difficult as hell to handle. Solar and wind seem like smarter choices to me. The only hurdle is battery life, really. That's fixed by investing more money into making better batteries. So we'd kind of just be solid forever pretty much.

That is, until we figure out controlled fusion. Eventually.

[Drydess]

also with powerwall you can literally sell your energy back, you produce so much

[beachbum111111]

Long enough?

Doesn't answer my question

Cloud cover isn't dependent on temperature, by the way.

No stuff Sherlock, that's not what I meant. Cold weather generally isn't kind to batteries.

[Kingdaro]

The battery is able to run at temperatures between -5 and 117 degrees Fahrenheit. Asking for more than that is kind of ridiculous unless you live waaay up north.

But hey, like I said, better batteries.

[beachbum111111]

The battery is able to run at temperatures between -5 and 117 degrees Fahrenheit. Asking for more than that is kind of ridiculous unless you live waaay up north.

But hey, like I said, better batteries.

Well I don't live waaaay up north and yet winters are an average of -20 here, many times it goes up to -50 here.

[Kingdaro]

Well hey, good news is if we keep denying climate change, it'll definitely get warmer up there.

But seriously,

better batteries.

We could invest in safer ways of disposing of nuclear waste, but... eh? And I'm not really against nuclear, it's just... it doesn't seem all that worth it given our other options.

[FreedomBringer]

There shall be no mexicans not contributing to society on my watch.