Flat or Progressive Income Tax?

Author Topic: Flat or Progressive Income Tax?  (Read 2869 times)

environment doesn't need to be protected, stuff doesn't need to be regulated
Uh, yes they do.
and roads? you seriously don't know how roads are profitable?
Do you want toll booths on every road?

stuff doesn't need to be regulated

before food was regulated, it was common to find sawdust in flour and watered-down milk
borax and formaldehyde were preservatives
don't even get me started on quack medicine

I'm a bit skeptical about progressive taxes. The rich due on top and lobby his best friends in the government to give him a tax cut while the poor dude on the bottom is too broke for anything. Meanwhile the middle class person is getting bled dry because he isn't poor enough nor he is too rich enough to maintain his or her life style.

lol
military spending is the #1 thing we need to cut
I wish it was that easy.
Contrary to popular belief, the US can't beat every one up. Almost everyone in the world is modernizing their military right now. Some of concern would be Russia and China.

Funding needs to be enough to allow the military to develop and improve technologies and enough to maintain itself. While the Army and USMC say they don't need new tanks, they still require maintenance, fuel, and ammo. The same can be said for a lot of things about are military.

The other problem is that most of NATO expects us to come save their ass if something bad happens. Because of this, they defense funding, in fact many NATO armies are just mere shadows of what they use to be.

Basically we need enough money to keep our military decent as possible while  being able to adapt to the world. Politically we will probably have to tell our allies to pull their own weight.

Do you want toll booths on every road?
I didn't say toll booths
you make a road to your business. people can now drive to your business. your business can now get more money.

stuff doesn't need to be regulated
Have you, or anyone you've ever known, taken medication?
Without the FDA there, there's nothing to stop a company from selling you a pill of nothing (or worse, something harmful) and saying "yeah this will totally cure your disease lol"
Want to have a job in pretty much any field that's not office work, without an agency like OSHA? have fun lol
Want to eat or drink anything, ever? Have fun with that without any sort of health regulations
I could go on and on but if you don't get the point now you never will

you seriously don't know how roads are profitable?
Roads provide a tremondous benefit....
....to an entire community. Thus it's cost is split amongst an entire community.
But a single bridge or mile of road costs millions of dollars. There's no way a business can make millions of profit off a single bridge, unless you want to see tolls on every single loving road

You also completely ignored police and fire department

I didn't say toll booths
you make a road to your business. people can now drive to your business. your business can now get more money.
yeah news flash kid
Very fews businesses have the money it takes to pay for roads to be built and maintained
« Last Edit: January 26, 2015, 12:08:55 AM by Headcrab Zombie »

Have you, or anyone you've ever known, taken medication?
Without the FDA there, there's nothing to stop a company from selling you a pill of nothing (or worse, something harmful) and saying "yeah this will totally cure your disease lol"
Want to have a job in a risky field without an agency like OSHA? have fun dying lol
Want to eat or drink anything, ever? Have fun with that without any sort of health regulations
I could go on and on but if you don't get the point now you never will
Roads provide a tremondous benefit....
....to an entire community. Thus it's cost is split among an entire community.
But a single bridge costs millions of dollars. There's no way a business can make millions of profit off a single bridge, unless you want to see tolls on every single loving road

You also completely ignored police and fire department
yeah news flash kid
Very fews businesses have the money it takes to pay for roads to be build
People can brown townyze things themselves. So and so medication doesn't work, someone makes an article, people stop buying it, they go out of business.

 Risky jobs are for poor people.

If some businessmen want to make a new commercial area separated by a river, they can pool their money together to get a bridge built. Or a ferry or whatever.

Criminals get fines and you can too I'd you let your house get lit on fire.

I'm sure those big franchised businesses can get a road built, otherwise dirt roads.

Risky jobs are for poor people.
Criminals get fines and you can too I'd you let your house get lit on fire.
I'm sure those big franchised businesses can get a road built, otherwise dirt roads.
I think I get it now. You're just messing around. You aren't even being serious at all.

Taxes are a necessary evil to keep all those we take for granted running. We can't tax just one thing and expect to be fine. That's we have fines, sales and sin tax, and income tax.

People can brown townyze things themselves. So and so medication doesn't work, someone makes an article, people stop buying it, they go out of business.
And what about the people hurt (either by a harmful substance passed as a medication, or a disease allowed to run untreated, additionally infecting more people) between the release and the article?

Risky jobs are for poor people.
I'm sure those big franchised businesses can get a road built, otherwise dirt roads.
These two points are nothing more than "if you don't have money, forget you"
Your first claim is entirely bullstuff, there's plenty of risky jobs with good wages; an oil rig worker can easily make 100k, if you do a little research you can find plenty more risky high paying jobs
The second is a "forget you" to small business

Criminals get fines and you can too I'd you let your house get lit on fire.
You're creating a business that makes criminals in order to profit. This is how the US prison system works now, and it does not work; we have one of the highest recidivism rates and prison populations in the developed world, because it is more profitable for them to criminalize trivial things and them not actually reintegrate them after jailing



At this point you're either a) trolling or b) a kid with no clue how the world works. I'm going to bed now

*extremely educated voice* progressive

I'm a supporter of FairTax. Basically, we'd remove the system of income tax and replace it with taxes when you use your money. At first that might seem pointless, but there's an absolutely great thing that it does.

The FairTax system allows people to keep every single dollar of the money they earn. This means that the amount of money you have available to spend on investments is the full amount of money you earned minus what you need to spend (plus the tax amount). Where as if you paid tax up-front, that extra money is completely inaccessible to you. With FairTax, you can use that money you would be paying to taxes on your spare income to invest, which increases the profitability of your investments. Then, eventually, when you spend that money you made, you pay full tax on it.

This increases the amount of money available for investment into the private and public sectors. People can use this extra money that they aren't paying taxes on because they don't need to spend it to buy government bonds which allows the government to use this money while providing the people with a benefit. When they eventually get this money back (plus the bond appreciation), they can spend it and pay full tax on it. They can also invest into the private sector and help companies that need that extra cash to operate exist. And at the end of the day, the government ends up getting every penny they would if a Flat Tax existed.



Totally different note, this is primarily in response to Headcrab Zombie. The FDA is an absolutely egregious institution of government. It costs companies so much money to go through the FDA approval process that it makes it nearly impossible to launch new drugs in America. I am completely for the abolishment of the FDA. And before you repeat your arguments to me about how people need medicine to be approved, I agree. For that, I say look to the EU. The European Union has no government-run drug administration. Instead, they've privatized the drug regulation system. Instead of going through the bloated, slow, and immensely rigorous process the FDA requires, the EU has companies that exist purely to approve products for sale. These companies make money off a percentage of sales the drugs make because they hold their approval emblem. What this has lead to is a cheaper process to have drugs approved for consumption in foreign markets.

Now the natural response to this is, "Wait, Trinick, isn't it better to have a more rigorous system that way we're sure the drugs the public takes are safe?" The short answer is no. Having such a rigorous system for drug approval means that Americans don't get access to new drugs while Europeans do. Almost every single new drug created by every company is approved in Europe faster than it is in America. The reason isn't that Europe allows unsafe drugs to be released to the public, it's that the FDA is so bad at regulating drugs that it simply isn't cost effective to launch them in America. The normal route of progression for a successful, safe drug follows: Development (6 - 10 Years), European Approval (2 - 4 Years), European Profits (4 - 10 Years), American Approval (4 - 8 Years), Western Profits. This means that at best a successful drug will reach the American market 16 years after its initial discovery, and it could easily take 25 or more years, if it ever reaches FDA approval. Compare that to the EU where they gain access to this drug only 8-14 years after the drug is discovered.

Again, the natural response is that looser approval requirements will allow more unsafe drugs into the consumer market. Sure, that could happen. But really, it doesn't. European regulation agencies aren't in the business of putting their seal of approval on dangerous drugs. It discredits their name and opens them up to lethal lawsuits that would annihilate the agency. What ends up happening is that they filter through drugs in an efficient and quick way that, at the end of the day, opens up people in need of these drugs to be able to take them. Obviously this isn't the only line of defense either; doctors will not prescribe new and potentially unproven drugs unless they are the only option. I don't know about you, but I would rather someone with treatment resistant major depression have access to a new miracle drug that has done very well in clinical trials than restrict them access to this lifesaver and have them commit Self Delete. Or maybe it's something more serious: a patient with a rare treatment resistant terminal cancer that has exhausted all their options. They've tried Chemo, they've tried radiation therapy, they've tried eating Vitamin C and drinking blended grass, but they're not in remission. There's a drug recently approved in the EU to treat their condition, but it hasn't even begun the process in America yet. This patient dies because they do not have access to that drug, and that's a tragedy.

The FDA is great on paper. In reality, it stifles American drug innovation, strangulates drug companies that want to launch drugs in America, and prevents people who need these new drugs from accessing them. We're living during a medical boom that's creating thousands of new promising drugs, but Americans don't get to have any of it. Companies are forced to launch their products in other locales where the approval process is cheaper until profits turnaround and they can initiate the immensely expensive and long process of having their drugs approved for sale in America.

People can brown townyze things themselves. So and so medication doesn't work, someone makes an article, people stop buying it, they go out of business.
The forget?
How on earth you can tolerate the concept of thousands (or hundreds of thousands as it would repeat) of people being conned into using medicines/treatments (at their own expense) which either do absolutely nothing, or harm them, I do not know.
You would rather that than everyone loses part of a cent on their earnings/spending?

You're an idiot if you don't think the idea of society collectively pulling together (and just by paying taxes) to help keep everyone safe is a good one. Sure, argue over how much each person should give, or what areas our efforts should be focussed on, but to say that there should be no effort and no co-operation is just ridiculous.



Totally different note, this is primarily in response to Headcrab Zombie. The FDA is an absolutely egregious institution of government.
It was an example. I didn't feel like digging up a bunch of good agencies so I just listed the first few that came to mind.
I'm aware of how slow and expensive the FDA's approval process is, I hadn't heard of the EU's system, but it sounds good