Author Topic: Are any people in America actually oppressed?  (Read 22733 times)

im talking about rambo and anyone else pretending the cycle of poverty doesnt exist

You should have addressed them personally then instead of attacking the whole demographic, because I was a white, middle-class male who went through poverty and homelessness and I know more about this topic than your sorry ass does.


some of ya'll gotta take a look in a mirror and think about what you're doing right now smh
Agreed.
It's pretty easy to dismiss that others have it rough when on a forum that requires, at minimum, a computer, internet access, and the free time and money to purchase PC games.

i'm not big on felony disenfranchisement

You should have addressed them personally then instead of attacking the whole demographic, because I was a white, middle-class male who went through poverty and homelessness and I know more about this topic than your sorry ass does.
I didn't attack a whole demographic. I qualified, middle class white people who use that particular rhetoric.

If you went through poverty or homelessness then you weren't middle class, at least then.

im talking about rambo and anyone else pretending the cycle of poverty doesnt exist
lolwat I never denied it, stuff's real dude, but pinpointing it on a single race and blaming them for the cycle of poverty is pretty forgetin stupid.

I dont think a white patriarchy exists. I do believe in the proven fact that white people have more privileges than any other race in the united states. Also I love how you bring up kendrick lamar as a way of saying "you should all be like kendrick lamar" even though the ironic part is that rap is one of the only ways black people can actually become successful.
now that's a forgetin stereotype if I've ever seen one.

apparently black people are only good at rapping and nothing else it seems.

For white people, you're already likely to be born into a middle-upper class family. You're already going to a good middle school, getting good grades, going to a good high school, being encouraged to do better, getting into a great college, getting a high paying job. For us, the first step, which is going to a good school, doesn't exist.
what bullstuff, not only have I been born into a middle-upper class family, but I've had stuff grades my entire life and am not going to college, and do not have a high paying job. Not only that, but I've seen multiple other colored families in my area and elsewhere who are way more wealthier than I am by miles.

Statistically, bad schools have a low graduation rate. Statistically, zoned schools in poor neighborhoods are bad. Statistically, white people have a better shot at making it to the top. For us it's just a fluke, and requires the iron will that 90% of humans lack by default.
Well my school is trash and their graduation rates are insanely good, so don't know what you're talking about there, same with a ton of other schools in my county. And that dumb stuff about you guys having to put in more work than others? Yeah that's bullstuff, many a many of hispanic and colored kids I know have had way better opportunities than I have both in and outside of school.

If you were subjected to this injustice, you would be agreeing with me & everyone else who says that education is one of the defining factors of success and failure. The fact that you think we have the ability to be successful despite having a poor education shows that you actually have no clue who what when where or why you're talking about.
There is no injustice, there's only you being a whiny cunt and painting this as a straightforward scenario with a black and white scenario (in terms of perspective), the amount of variables to a discussion like this are insanely huge, but in your mind, if you've had a terrible education and you're colored, you're guaranteed to failure.

grow. up.


i'm not sure what you mean, perry is right in saying that black people (and others) were victims of legitimate, institutionalized, legally recognized and accepted de jure discrimination that definitely had a substantial impact on their ability to be successful and competitive in the economy, and that these things happened all the way up into last century. obviously, even if the legal barriers are removed, the effects those policies had still remained, and the children of those who experienced those effects directly inherited those problems.
Absolutely, but to say that if your environment is stuff then you're guaranteed to become stuff is well, stuff.

The same people always bring up the same arguments, about how black people would be successful if they tried. How about this: if you become a father, try leaving your children. Try not supporting your family and letting your single mother ex struggle to raise her child. Then watch as they move to a more affordable neighborhood in order to stay alive. Watch how the child is forced to attend a stuffty school because of his/her economic status, and watch as their chances of success slowly decrease to a 2-3%.

Once you can witness this happening in real time, come back to me and i'll admit my wrongs.
well yeah you're not wrong there, that's very common in today's world, don't see what your point is.

We're literally stuck in an endless cycle of poor parenthood, educational neglect & poor self esteem. The only way to leave that cycle is for us to either win the loving lottery or for the education system to be vastly reformed. Until then, the worst thing you can do as an outside individual is dismiss this issue.
I agree that our education system needs to be reformed incredibly, but I'm not dismissing the issue, all I'm saying is that to say that only one race experiences it and is stuck with it is pretty ignorant.

Well, same-love couples used to be oppressed until the supreme court ruling. While it seems somewhat less likely that Annoying Orange wants this to be reversed as he said he "accepted" the result of the supreme court, he did say he was going to be appointing "conservative" nominees, who would undeniably be more likely to upturn that ruling.

Blacks were undeniably oppressed at the very least up until the end of segregation and other discriminatory laws. There are even still some laws in place that discriminate disproportionately towards blacks, such as voter ID laws and laws against marijuana possession, as two examples. There's also a very real argument to be made about the poverty cycle. Blacks were obviously very much pushed towards poverty before segregation ended, and I remember reading a paper somewhere about the so-called "economic glass ceiling," which is basically a way of saying "Even if you do everything right, it's still unlikely that you'll get above this point." And the research seemed solid. I think I saved it somewhere, if i find it I'll be sure to post it.

We also have to remember that economic status of a race is not a black and white thing. It's a spectrum ranging from no income or posessions at all to being some of the wealthiest people alive, with certain levels of income far more likely than others. And yes, there is a distinct difference between the median incomes of black and white people.

I went ahead and datamined http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0104552.html which takes data directly from the US census and graphed the distribution.



As you can see, black families are far more likely to be within the $10k-$15k range, and still even more likely to be within the $15k-35k range.

And that's reflected in the median income per race:

White: $56,866
Black: $35,398

I don't like this argument. You write it off by saying that women aren't as ambitious and that they tend to settle for less, when that is literally one of the causes of the wage gap that feminists are trying to diagnose.
No, my argument isn't that it doesn't exist, it's that it DOES exist, and of course that's bad. I'm certainly not 'writing it off', but the 77 cent figure is crazy and misleading. 96-97 is still a problem, of course, but I'm correcting both INH (who says it doesn't exist) and many feminists (who say it does exist in ridiculous proportions).

No one is saying those things don't happen, but rather that they shoudn't happen, because its socialized.
I agree, and that's my argument. It's not employers being malicious and discriminatory, it's women often feeling inadequate. Both are problems, but I think we can agree the former is much larger.

I choose to take things like the wage gap as being a nurture/socialization thing based on evidence and on the idea that being wrong about it being nurture/socialized is probably more just than being wrong about it being nature.
I think it's both--women are often taught to be more kind and humble or that they belong in the home, while men are often taught to be more ambitious. However, we can't disregard the very obvious natural components to it--that being that men are generally genetically more aggressive and confident.

So, I think you misunderstood me a bit. We agree on most of this.


Native Americans - Have been forcibly removed from their lands, conquered, murdered, and raped for over 500 years. In today's society, the only oppression that they face is the intrusion of business and government on their specified lands. All native Reservations are under their own laws and are governed independent of the United States government, yet companies are allowed to construct pipelines on their land that they own. This is unconstitutional on every level, as private companies don't have the right to construct things on your property unless you give them the right or the government has a warranty. The natives are being oppressed in the sense that they are losing the right to their land that they legally own and govern.

I'll give this to you. Granted, you're forgetting the tons of murdering and raping that they did to us, but murdering and raping innocent people is bad on both sides of the aisle.
In my opinion, the problem with reservations and being forced off their land could've been fixed through assimilation. That's a huge maybe, though.

Illegal Immigrants - although they moved to the united states illegally, they are still human beings, and can still be oppressed. There have been intensive reports on businesses hiring illegal immigrants cheaply and extorting them under the condition that they may be deported if they are revealed.

There's an easy fix to that, and that's to become a legal citizen.
Also, define "extorting". To me, that means anything from less pay (deserved for actively breaking the law) to beating the stuff out of them for looking at you funny (not okay under any context).

Let's be honest, here, they did set themselves up to be treated like this. You're immigrating to a country where you feel you can flourish and a country in which you feel they'll help you and the first thing you do is get on their bad side by breaking the law, immigrating illegally. You don't deserve a safety net for willingly and knowingly breaking the law.
To add onto that, if the climate in America is just as bad or even worse for these illegals as it is in their country of origin, and these conditions can be fixed by just coming legally, then what's stopping them from at least hopping onto the waiting list?

You're also assuming that the only type of illegal immigrants is ones looking for work. Don't forget the ones that come trafficking drugs, raping Americans and engaging in tons of crime. But I'd be "tribal" for pointing those people out, so that's all you'll hear out of me.

African Americans - self explanatory. Today, oppression isn't as bad as it was before but there's still a huge segregation of school systems. Since african americans are statistically poor due to the lasting effects of slavery, segregation etc. they are often forced to attend zone schools, which like their neighborhoods, are poorly maintained, underfunded, and generally stuffty. As they grow up, their teachers make no attempt to help them, much of the schools problems go unsolved and in general a large portion of black teens grow up thinking that they are bad students and have no future. The teachers treat them like such, and as a result the mentality grows and affects other students, resulting in increased crime rates, poorer grades, violence, etc. States make little to no effort to fund these schools, and rarely document the actual states of their schools.

Yeah, but the segregation of schools is not written into law. No corporation is forcing these people into these schools lest they be punished. It's voluntary segregation. No one's above these people, forcing these people to go to these schools or forcing them to be poor, so you can't really say that they're being treated unfairly. You can't even say that they're being "treated" by anyone. This isn't oppression.
Not to mention this is somewhat invalidated by affirmative action, which mandates that students be picked for them being black over their merits. You also leave out Minority Scholarships, given only to minorities for the same reason.

This problem would've been fixed with stricter policing of black communities, but don't forget, that's "tribal" to some blacks. You can only have it one way.

Ultimately, this is a self-inflicted wound. It's obvious that the majority of blacks support the Democratic party. The problem with that is that the party's platform completely opposes nearly everything that would fix this; student vouchers, merit-based pay, etc. etc. Such opposition of these things stands completely contradictory to what you and the black community wants (to fix this), yet they keep voting them in. The parts of this that could be defined as oppression are self-inflicted.

You're probably going to say something along the lines of "well thats not oppression!" and i'm just going to preemptively call you an idiot just so i can quote it before you say it.

Nice assumption. Sadly for you, though, I provided reasoning. I don't just blurt out things without reasoning because that would be handicapped.

You're also probably going to say "well its their fault!!!" or something along those lines and to that i'm going to refute it with the concept of white guilt.

Blacks ran down, captured and sold other blacks to European settlers of the New World. Native Americans also bought and owned these slaves, alongside some rich, free black men.
Mexico actively invited Americans into Texas and then killed a huge chunk of them at the Alamo after they revolted from poor representation in the government.
The Japanese committed the Nanking Massacre, and Genghis Khan did some really forgeted up stuff to people he and the Mongols attacked.
And of course, you have the whole "Muslim" thing.
Correct me if I missed any groups that aren't white.

Stop pretending that just because someone's ancestors did something, that means they automatically try to compensate for it when they make points against things like this. If that were true, I could say the same about you judging from the things I've listed, but it's quite clear that you don't give a stuff about the past, like me.

When you use a buzz-phrase like "white guilt", it stops being intelligent debate and it becomes finger-pointing and name-calling. It's literally the worst debating you can possibly do.



Overall you got a score of 1/3 (at least).

gov't points a gun to your head and steals a percentage of the income you've earned - yes, people in america are oppressed


"Just become a legal citizen" that requires lots of time and money, something they have neither of.

Further, you're ignoring the cycle of poverty.

Rambo- just because you don't see it in a few people around you, doesn't disprove its existence in a country of 319 million people.


O K but they still had like 9 billion chances for their children to eventually get into school, to properly educate themselves, to get their children a better life aswell, and to therefor not cause what we have now. even if life was stuff back then, that is NOT an excuse to skip out on learning. the people who protest at school about Annoying Orange winning do this, and it is equally not an excuse.
snip
White: $56,866
Black: $35,398

ok sure but maybe if so many black people actually had an income and didnt rely on welfare then that would be different hun
« Last Edit: December 01, 2016, 11:31:07 AM by crazies alt »

Yeah, but the segregation of schools is not written into law. No corporation is forcing these people into these schools lest they be punished. It's voluntary segregation. No one's above these people, forcing these people to go to these schools or forcing them to be poor, so you can't really say that they're being treated unfairly. You can't even say that they're being "treated" by anyone. This isn't oppression.
You have to go to the school that your area is zoned into. If you want to go to a different school, you have to move into a neighborhood that is in that school's zone.

So yes, they are forced into those schools.

Also, schools are paid for in large part by local government, mostly property tax. So if you live in a poor neighborhood with low value houses and cheap apartments, then that area's schools are going to be less funded. If you want to go to a school with better funding, you have to live in an area with higher value houses or more expensive apartments, which simply isn't accessible to a lot of people
« Last Edit: December 01, 2016, 12:57:26 PM by Headcrab Zombie »